quote:Originally posted by WJ: if your not a democrat by age 20 you have no heart but if your not a republican by age 30 you have no brain i just wanted to say that
Kerry should have won, and may have had he not conceded so early. I know for a fact that there were problems in Iowa and Ohio with voting machines and incorrect felony lists. I helped run my local democratic office and worked my butt for months for Kerry. Election day we got an email from main headquarters in Iowa that there was a felony list out containing 85% of people who were NOT felons. There were also problems with some voting machines in Iowa. Ohio, as usual, had problems. The doors were being closed on people already in line, which is against the law. A recount in any state that has eletronic voting machines wouldn't do anything due to the fact that many didn't have any paper trail so the machine will continue to spat out the same numbers. Kerry did the right thing by not making Americans go through another 2000. We may never who actually should have won this election because of so many flaws and electronic voting machines.
Don't take life too serious. You'll never escape it alive anyway.
quote:Originally posted by WJ: if your not a democrat by age 20 you have no heart but if your not a republican by age 30 you have no brain i just wanted to say that
You hacked up that quote you moron. It is
"If you are young and a republican you have no heart, if you are old and a socialist you have no brain" -Churchill-
O of where dost thou hail, Celephanil, Celephanil? Why dost thou wander in Tengelwar great, why on the sea do you sail?
I was totally for Kerry but there was no way realistically that he could have won. I mean it had gotten too hard. Yes, I think Kerryshould have won but you know and I knoww that wishes sometimes don't come true. Thanks! Bye!
House Judiciary Committee Letter to GAO Investigate voting machines!
"November 5, 2004
The Honorable David M. Walker
Comptroller General of the United States
U.S. General Accountability Office
441 G Street, NW
Washington, DC 20548
Dear Mr. Walker:
We write with an urgent request that the Government Accountability Office immediately undertake an investigation of the efficacy of voting machines and new technologies used in the 2004 election, how election officials responded to difficulties they encountered and what we can do in the future to improve our election systems and administration.
In particular, we are extremely troubled by the following reports, which we would also request that you review and evaluate for us:
In Columbus, Ohio, an electronic voting system gave President Bush nearly 4,000 extra votes. "Machine Error Gives Bush Extra Ohio Votes," Associated Press, November 5.
An electronic tally of a South Florida gambling ballot initiative failed to record thousands of votes. "South Florida OKs Slot Machines Proposal," Id.
In one North Carolina county, more than 4,500 votes were lost because officials mistakenly believed a computer that stored ballots could hold more data that it did. "Machine Error Gives Bush Extra Ohio Votes," Id.
In San Francisco, a glitch occurred with voting machines software that resulted in some votes being left uncounted. Id.
In Florida, there was a substantial drop off in Democratic votes in proportion to voter registration in counties utilizing optical scan machines that was apparently not present in counties using other mechanisms. http://ustogether.org/election04/florida_vote_patt.htm
The House Judiciary Committee Democratic staff has received numerous reports from Youngstown, Ohio that voters who attempted to cast a vote for John Kerry on electronic voting machines saw that their votes were instead recorded as votes for George W. Bush. In South Florida, Congressman Wexler's staff received numerous reports from voters in Palm Beach, Broward and Dade Counties that they attempted to select John Kerry but George Bush appeared on the screen. CNN has reported that a dozen voters in six states, particularly Democrats in Florida, reported similar problems. This was among over one thousand such problems reported. "Touchscreen Voting Problems Reported," Associated Press, November 5.
Excessively long lines were a frequent problem throughout the nation in Democratic precincts, particularly in Florida and Ohio. In one Ohio voting precinct serving students from Kenyon College, some voters were required to wait more than eight hours to vote. "All Eyes on Ohio," Dan Lothian, CNN, November 3, http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/blog/1...blog/index... ..
We are literally receiving additional reports every minute and will transmit additional information as it comes available. The essence of democracy is the confidence of the electorate in the accuracy of voting methods and the fairness of voting procedures. In 2000, that confidence suffered terribly, and we fear that such a blow to our democracy may have occurred in 2004.
Thank you for your prompt attention to this inquiry.
Sincerely,
John Conyers, Jr. Jerrold Nadler Robert Wexler
Ranking Member Ranking Member Member of Congress
House Judiciary Committee Subcommittee on the Constitution
cc: Hon. F. James Sensenbrenner
Chairman"
This is only a small fraction of what's been going on, but at least they're starting to catch on.
quote:As for Bush getting extra ballots, not every county used that same kind of voting method, and I certainly don't think it would have given Bush an extra 300,000 votes.
1. I didn't say that was the ONLY way Bush got extra votes. I'm not even saying for sure that he DID get any more extra votes. I'm saying it is POSSIBLE that other voting machines were malfunctioning as well, and there HAVE been reports of provisional ballot abuse, so it's something that was worth looking into and considering longer than half a day.
2. Even if there were not enough fake votes to put Kerry ahead, there might be enough to put him in a more reasonable position for litigation.
I honestly think this election has been very questionable. Why the **** is it that everyone in this country seems less concerned with election integrity than they do with just "getting it over with"? I think it's a reprehensible attitude to take, regardless of how popular it seems to be nowadays.
Yeah, Kerry made the right choice. This simply wasn't like 2000. Kerry conceded after it reached a point where he would need over 75% of the remaining votes in Ohio to go to him, and that just wasn't realistic. Also, Bush had 3% of the popular vote on him, and while that doesn't matter per se, it still says something.
Gore, however, was perfectly justified in pushing for the Florida recounts back in 2000.
And then, as the books were told, Fina replied: "A can of worms, my dear friend? What has this to do with reason?"
I am sorry to say but I don't think litigation would have been right in this case. I supported John Kerry but he was smart enough to know when to call it quits, not drag out the election. As for Bush getting extra ballots, not every county used that same kind of voting method, and I certainly don't think it would have given Bush an extra 300,000 votes. Ultimately, he knew that he could not win Ohio, even with all the votes left, it just wasn't possible. Sometimes you have to do things that aren't good but it certainly wasn't backstabbing.
1. I think John Kerry backstabbed his supporters when he conceded before every vote was counted.
2. There are some really sketchy numbers coming out of swing states in the last day or two. Litigation would have been an option, but Kerry ducked out early. Even though he already collected money from his supporters specifically for litigation purposes. Wonder where that money will go now if it's not refunded?
3. Yahoo news is already reporting the story of machines in one Florida precinct giving Bush more than 3,000 extra votes! 3,000 from just one precinct-- imagine how many "extra" votes may be uncovered tomorrow, or worse yet, may never be detected at all. It's sickening.
He wouldn't have conceded if he could still win. I think what Gore did- force recounts dozens of times- was a bit sore-loser-ish, and I'm glad that Kerry had the pride and dignity to gracefully admit defeat. More than I can say about myself.
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