There's this this new commercial about how it's offensive to say the "r word" (I hope you can guess it). Soon it's gonna be up there with the "n word." What do you think about it? Is it okay to say it or not?

True I guess whatever road u take will just lead u back to a debate, or an ugly disagreement. Maybe this debate should be dropped and not brought back up. Thx by the way, i like ur name too.

quote:

And hoops is absolutly right. The people who have all the names to taunt, hurt, frustrate them need to learn to get over it. There isn't a day where those words will be deleted from this world. I've been called nigger before. I learned not to care. My strategy, blow them off.

Yeah my view on this is that it should be shrugged off, too. Also, I do usually bat this word around quite often, but just in a jokingly way.

eww what kind of name is sesshomaru. what a noob.

jk, i love it.

Isn't it almost going back on what you just said, however, that words and names and insults do not matter but we should not attack people, we should attack the point.

In debate you attack both. I don't mean you should say 'This person is an idiot and they are stupid so they are wrong.' But if you can discredit said person by using what they have debated doesn't that simply prove your point more? This is why debate is stupid. Discussion is better, however that usually will lead to some inevitable disagreement, and, thus debate rears its ugly head yet again.

attack, attack, attack. Easy no need for this much violence on a debate is senseless. this may be between u two but no need for biscuit to fuss, and attack other users. Ok. *sigh* and of course wolfie makes more sense than biscuit realizes.

To me hoops sounded like he was attacking the point. It was condridicting but that was planned.

And hoops is absolutly right. The people who have all the names to taunt, hurt, frustrate them need to learn to get over it. There isn't a day where those words will be deleted from this world. I've been called nigger before. I learned not to care. My strategy, blow them off.
Like a duck's feathers. Allow the insults to roll off ur back and get on with ur life.

quote:

by Meagan87:
As far as I'm concerned, if there's a word that is questionably offensive, with it being just as easy to make a different word choice...why wouldn't you?

I agree with you, and that is how things should be, but I have a really hard time refraining from using those words because I don't think of them as offensive words. I am aware that the things I say can hurt other people, so I do try to tone it down around them, but I don't think I will ever stop saying them completely...

I also want to say (again, lol) that if everyone in the world made a conscious decision to start being nice, fine, but there should never be any regulation of what you can and can't say.
I only mentioned this again because I am curious to see if anyone out there disagrees. I would just like to hear an opposing argument for it b/c I have never found one before.

My take on the "R word" and similar words:

They are words. It's not like a single word is such a substantial part of your life that you can't do without it. As far as I'm concerned, if there's a word that is questionably offensive, with it being just as easy to make a different word choice...why wouldn't you?

South Africa is a beautiful country if you're white. It's probably the nicest nation in Africa when it comes to things like poverty and disease. lol, you live there, shouldn't you know this?

Goodness, I really dislike these kids who flip out any time their 'character' may be a tiny bit insulted. I called you foolish. ie You are foolish because of the points you are making. They aren't points at all , they are just you trying to make an arguement out of nothing.

So, you needed to learn from college and from your professor that the term 'mental retarded' is politically incorrect. Wow is all I'm saying seeing as how I pretty much knew you shouldn't say that when I was in middle school, as did the other children in my class. So I'm just surprised that a person who is attending a college doesn't know it is quite inappropiate to say "that person has mental retardation."

Of course you're going to say that that is an attack on your character and you'll whine about it and you won't get over it.

That's how a debate is. You don't just argue the issues as strictly 'the issues' if people did that this world would be very uninteresting. A good debator takes evidence and uses it in a creative manner so that it makes the other debator and their evidence look foolish. I said that it is politically incorrect to say 'mentally retarded.' You said no and that you know so because you're a medical student. Then you found out you were wrong about something that the majority of people know and yet you continued to debate me.

lol, what exactly can be debated about this issue anyways... not a lot. Either you say it or you don't. enough said. So good luck with finding better posters. lmao. the only ones are clpo and brehon and they don't come on much.

lol, i love noobs

dude! for fuck's sake, you''ve obviously NEVER taken part in a REAL debate! telling someone they contradict themselves is pointing out flaws in the argument and NOT attacking the person! and don't come tell me about the kind of world I grew up in, come visit South Africa and spend a couple of years here before you even THINK of making assumptions like that.

I came to YN for proper debates, where people discuss points and not the flaws in such and such's friggin character. my god. i've found some rather intelligent debaters on here, people who understand the essence of a discussion and argument, but this thread is obviously not one of them. so you keep "laughing your fat ass off" and bieng ridiculously immature while i occupy myself with better debaters. i've stated my point, you've stated yours. there's no use in me repeating it a million times, since you're obviously going to continue harping on about trivial matters instead of analysing the important matter.

oh, and just sideways, "even your professor told you you're wrong"? yep, the same professor who miquoted from several ethical journals on camera in front of 350 medical students.forgive a student for trying to understand a professor's view, and then for at least having the decensy to apologize when the professor realizes her mistake.

lmao. Wow, told you.

Well, you started off 'attacking' another poster. Saying that they contradict themselves and such. So when I see you contradicting yourself, I'm going to point it out. It's what I do.

you clearly let words get to you because not once have i insulted you. I just said everyone knows that you're not supposed to say 'mentally retarded' except you. which apparently was true because you're professor even told you so.

i told you to stop acting foolish. if you think that's an insult than you must have grown up in a world where everything was sugar plums and lollipops.

lol, i never understood why people relate my signature to what i say.

i stand for love and peace. ie i don't believe people should kill others. i don't believe that people should abuse others.

this is yn. it's not the real world. it's a place where people come to debate.

so all i have to say is if you can't hang with the big dogs, get off the porch.

regarding my last post:

quote:

Originally posted by mariebiscuit:

you know what dear, i just love the way you love calling people hypocrites, then your sig is "I stand for love and peace" and THEN you go around insulting people. so much for love and peace and not being a hypocrite.

You know what makes YOU foolish is that you can't differentiate between a DISCUSSION and a PERSON. I am standing for a point here, and if that point offends you, for fuck's sake attack the point instead of ME. GROW UP.

Oh, and another thing: how can you say that words are just words and don't matter, yet at the same time tell me what is politically incorrect? and my little what if scenarios? Not real? I laughed. How is being black, Jewish, or the relative to a disabled person, and then being insulted, "not real"?

and lastly, I am a medicine student. One of our subjects is called MEDICAL ETHICS. And funny enough, part of what we do is what is or isn't allowed on paper when you diagnose someone. And writing that a toddler is suffering from "severe mental retardation" is allowed.

using that phrase off-handish or as a joke is paramount to insult. not as a diagnosis in medical context. face the facts.

Me and a group of fellow students just had a fat chat with our ethics professor - turns out we completely missunderstood her.

so in light of that, i am retracting my point about "mental retardation" being politically correct. I don't personally feel that it is politically incorrect, but I now understand the reason for it being deemed as such, and I accept that.

So that's that.

HOWEVER, I continue to stand by the rest of my points, and suggest that you read through your own posts before telling others that they are contradicting themselves.

one last thing: I don't let words get to me, simply because I've learnt the hard way that it just makes life unbearable for myself, and because my issues are not big enough to be protected against verbal discrimination. But I still believe that we should protect those who are vulnerable and those who are more inclined to be discriminiated against verbally.

that, by the way, is the biggest reason verbal insults are so bad (including "retard") - because it encourages a mindset of discrimination.

quote:

Originally posted by Wolfie:
It's considered politically incorecct to say 'mental retardation.' It's 'mentally handicapped.' or 'devolpmentally challenged.'

Everyone knows this except you apparently.

you're little 'what if' scenario is stupid as are all 'what if' scenarios. they aren't real, so they don't matter.

stop contradicting yourself, you look foolish.

i seriously wouldn't care if you called me a honky, fire-crotched, dumb pollock.

They're just words. Get over it. If you let them affect you, aggressors wil
l continue to use them.

you know what dear, i just love the way you love calling people hypocrites, then your sig is "I stand for love and peace" and THEN you go around insulting people. so much for love and peace and not being a hypocrite.

You know what makes YOU foolish is that you can't differentiate between a DISCUSSION and a PERSON. I am standing for a point here, and if that point offends you, for fuck's sake attack the point instead of ME. GROW UP.

Oh, and another thing: how can you say that words are just words and don't matter, yet at the same time tell me what is politically incorrect? and my little what if scenarios? Not real? I laughed. How is being black, Jewish, or the relative to a disabled person, and then being insulted, "not real"?

and lastly, I am a medicine student. One of our subjects is called MEDICAL ETHICS. And funny enough, part of what we do is what is or isn't allowed on paper when you diagnose someone. And writing that a toddler is suffering from "severe mental retardation" is allowed.

using that phrase off-handish or as a joke is paramount to insult. not as a diagnosis in medical context. face the facts.

I'm not trying to start an argument. I just think that people who are offended by words need to deal with it.

It would be nice if everyone in the world magically decided to be nice and stopped using these words as insults or stopped using them altogether, however there should never be any kind of regulation of what people can say.

However, these words can be very offensive to many others, so I would refrain from using them. I dont' see a real point in trying to start arguments with words that offend many.

quote:

Originally posted by mariebiscuit:
Would THAT not offend you, hurt you, make you angry?

Who cares? It probably would piss me off, but why should there be laws against being rude? That's retarded. (I used the word on purpose.)

There should never be laws against offending someone. If you're thin-skinned about these kinds of things, you just need to learn to deal.

Freedom of Speech + Sticks and Stones = Nigger, Fag, Jew-Bastard, Pollock, Retard, Spick, whatever else...

People need to get over stupid words. They mean nothing.

It's considered politically incorecct to say 'mental retardation.' It's 'mentally handicapped.' or 'devolpmentally challenged.'

Everyone knows this except you apparently.

you're little 'what if' scenario is stupid as are all 'what if' scenarios. they aren't real, so they don't matter.

stop contradicting yourself, you look foolish.

i seriously wouldn't care if you called me a honky, fire-crotched, dumb pollock.

They're just words. Get over it. If you let them affect you, aggressors will continue to use them.

quote:

Originally posted by Wolfie:
see, I don't call people who are handicapped retards. I also don't think you should use terms like 'mental retardation' either because I believe that's politically incorrect. You're a hypocrite if you think 'retard' is politically incorrect and mental retardation isn't.

Ahem. Basic vocab: "to retard" is to slow or delay a process, or the abnormal development of something. Thus "mental retardation" is slowed, delayed or abnormal mental development. Which is what it is.Look it up in any language-, medical- or psychological dictionary.

A "retard" on the other hand, would be a personal description, wich is found offensive by members of the public. The offensive word "retard" was DERIVED from the objective term which CAME FIRST.

quote:

Originally posted by Wolfie:
I never understood this whole "society needs to get rid of stereotypes" thing. Yeah because name calling is totally destroying the way we live.
Whatever happened to 'sticks and stones.'

i don't know anything about you, but let's say you were of African ethnicity - would you not take offense at being called a "N"?
Say you were a Jew, would you not take offense at being called "a filthy Jew"?

OR, let's say you had a little sister with Down's Syndrome - with the symptom, AS QUOTED FROM MEDICAL DICTIONARIES, "severe mental retardation" (if you so prefer it say, "severe delay in mental functioning and/or development".

Let's say you love this little sister, because she's loving with a beautiful personality AND SHE'S YOUR SISTER FIRST AND FOREMOST. And you get to school and some bumhole walks up to you and says, "Dude, your sister is a retard, like, literally." Would THAT not offend you, hurt you, make you angry?


And lastly, people - if you have a problem with what I say, then attack the POINT and not the PERSON, cos honestly - these personal attacks are just plain crappy foruming.
Thank you

don't you hate it when people like say you're wrong and then basically repeat almost everything you just said?

quote:

Originally posted by mariebiscuit:
hoopdawg, your 1st and third point are actually contradicting each other - I won't go into that, I think by reading it it will explain itself.

...Yeah. That was my point. I have two contradicting ideas and right now I'm not sure which is stronger or which will win out. That's why I said that I can't make my personal decision on this topic right now...

quote:

IDK... I need to figure that out before I can form my opinion about it...

quote:

Originally posted by mariebiscuit:
with regards to equality, correct, they are supposed to be treated equally - and that is why we should protect individuals with mental retardation from insults just as we protect minority groups, different religions and so on.

That was part of what I said at the very beginning of my post- I don't think we should protect minority groups, religious groups, etc from words.

quote:

Originally posted by Wolfie:
Whatever happened to 'sticks and stones.'

Exactly. Thank you!

see, I don't call people who are handicapped retards. I also don't think you should use terms like 'mental retardation' either because I believe that's politically incorrect. You're a hypocrite if you think 'retard' is politically incorrect and mental retardation isn't. Would you consider it okay if I called someone who has mental retardation retarded? Of course, you would say that that is simply a part of their medical condition. So why not call them retards to? If I can say that they are retarded due to mental retardation doesn't that make them a retard?

See, that's why it's politically incorrect (i dislike political correctness anyways so do wat u want)

You're supposed to say handicapped.

Lol, you didn't read her post, she said she doesn't know her position on the arguement and she's just stating different sides. how does that make her a hypocrite? and who gives a shit anyways. everyone's a fucking hypocrite. we're all a bunch of walking contradictions. that's what it means to be human duh.

I never understood this whole "society needs to get rid of stereotypes" thing. Yeah because name calling is totally destroying the way we live.
Whatever happened to 'sticks and stones.'