how can you say that you are christian and then say that the bible is not accurate?
do you have proof of what you are saying? have you looked in places where there IS info that the bible is correct and that Jesus really did die on the cross? do you think that someone just got bored one day and decided that they wanted to make up all the stories of the bible to lead people astray? i believe in God and the bible, i have had the experiences to prove it...check your resources before you make claims!

disciple wrote:

quote:

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for reference: study ezekiel

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im a christian...havent been to church in a while, but im working on it.

so my point....

DONT QUOTE THE BIBLE!!! not much in the bible has been PROVEN to be historically accurate...my pastor says "well it hasnt been proven wrong" BUT IT HASNT BEEN PROVEN RIGHT EITHER!!

so please don't quote the bible. unless what you are quoting is HISTORICALLY accurate...that is =has been documented by HISTORIANS as HISTORICALLY accurate.

ps- actually you didnt technically "quote" the bible....however you did insinuate that the ezekiel chapter would offer some "reference"...reference to what? if you have some ACCURATE historical info, quote the ACTUAL words...dont quote the ENTIRE book, much of which im sure hasnt been proven as accurate.

disciple, nothing personal against you...you didnt even hurt me that much but i have to make an example

i think they have enough room to do .be what ever they want!

Does anyone else notice or even care that ever since the creation of Israel its government has been bending over backwards to try to give the Palestinians their own state, meeting every requirement of every agreement (Oslo, roadmap, HOW many cease-fires?) that would in the end minimize their OWN country...yet still it isn't enough for them and they feel the solution is to murder themselves and innocent civilians? When was the last time you heard of an Israeli blowing himself up in a Sbarro's restaurant and a year later a group of Jews set up a hit exhibit at an art museum glorifying the attack?! The mentalities of the Israelis and the politically influential Palestinian terrorists are as different as night and day. I strongly believe that Israeli and possibly international intervention in the West Bank and Gaza strip is needed to try to root out terrorism so that there is any hope for peace.
Also, I think the media can be one of the most powerful weapons for either side of this issue. It INFURIATES me when CNN uses sugar-coated jargon to describe a suicide bombing. Not once do they call Arab suicide bombers "terrorists", it's always "militants", "occupation protesters" or even the occasional "freedom fighters" or "martyrs"! If such an influential news station is using these words to describe brutal and inhumane terrorism, then the rest of the world will come to believe that the Palestinians are right to bomb innocent civilians, and the thought of that terrifies me.

what about when russia attacks on down the road?
them and all the arab countries that its allies with? of course israel is gonna massacre them but they're going to. dont worry when they do just lift your head and give Glory to God.

for reference: study ezekiel

in any argument, you can't expect the other side to stop. that has to be your job, you always need to be the person to stop or start something; there won't always be someone else to do so for you!! (the one thing my guidance counselor taught me).

-rito

If i were an Israeli(which i am)Id be pretty pissed if some people came and took the land from us first and then when we got it back, they'd decide to bomb themselves and kill thousnads of innocent people.If the "people" would just stop so would israel.

If I was a Palestinian, I would be really angry that a bunch of people suddenly moved to my land, and made their own country.

Does anybody else understand that?

i believe that all this fighting over in the middle east is wrong and that it shoud stop. if these two countries are allowed to continue fighting, then we could very well end up with 2 countries with no occupants. everyday we hear about more and more people getting killed over in the middle east because these countriea are both vying for more and more power than they shoud deserve. i dont think that the us has done all they could to put an end to this and restore some semblance of peace. Right now we are working on finding and stopping saddam when we should not have to in the first place, but we are because of leniancy in our government. if they became less lenient that we could easily send ambassadors over to the middle east to sort out the problems and then reach a compromise, which in turn would provide less of a possibility of WW3.

ugh... i get so tiered of repeating

it is partly based on biblic profecies. that is what has determined the US's role in the war over there. it has a great deal to do with which "son" is entitled to the land. i too wish that ppl could see that they all want the land for similar reasons and that they share a passion for it and that everyone could share the land that is so important to them.

i think u are very mistaen in some areas of ur post. for one, no one is claiming israel as jewish state by way of the bible. hell how many jews do u know that follow the "bible". israel is israel because the UN voted on it. zionist jews believe that isreal is justified partly because of the six million jews who lost their lives in the holocaust under hitler and his madment but no one is using that as an argument why the jews should live there.
secondly, the new testament only nullifies the old under christian belief. since when is christian belief the law? i mean, i think u'll find that the lessons taught in the new test. were taught years before in the old. and there were many men like jesus sry to burst ur bubble. elijah for example never died and did just as many "great" things.
now, the first ppl in israel were the canaaniites. so ur statement is correct that abraham was from ur. n e wayz i think ur looking way too much into the biblical aspects of it. well the world doesn't care sh!t about the biblical aspects when it comes to legality and justification. i mean hell all sorts of religions are laying claim to israel not just the jews.

well...i have a bias for israel just a warning.
well i dont think peace is n e where in the near future. i mean, part of the problem is calling the land "occupied". i mean wtf it was voted on by the UN and technically its isreali land. so the more we call it "occupied" the more ppl start to see israel as the bad guyz. don't get me wrong, im sure life is just as difficult for the palestinians as it is for the israelis i just think that they should back off a bit. i mean they have tons of other land in Saudi Arabia. and besides that i have no problem with them living on israeli land they just need to accept that thats what it is..israeli.
on the pace issue though: war rarely ever brings about peace but in this case i think the only way to achieve piece is to fight back. i think israel needs to stop listening to bushwhacker and his crazy friends and do what they think they should. bush is only prolonging the violence with is peace talks and stuff. im all for trying for peace and waiting for some headway but maybe its time to stop waiting. don't u think over a 1000 years for a jewish homeland is waiting enough?

Oh man...please tell me you didnt just compare you're hair products to land....lol ok?

I still agree,both sides are to blame but from my point of view the arabs take more of the blame, its hard not to say that with the jihad and hizbalah and those terrorirs organizations....and im sure that if the arabs stopped so would Israel.And im sure they'de be welcomed nicely in israel if they didnt try to kill them DAILY!

Most of the participants that have established what to them seems a fact, do not in fact take into account that the history of the world did not begin exactly when Israel was established as a kingdom by David. If matters are to be taken as who was there first or who came from where first, then the Israeli view will be seriously shaken, for prophet Abraham came from Ur in Iraq, not the Ma'ale Adumim settlement. Another erroneous idea that the conservatives and jews participating in this forum seem to have is that jews have the right to live in Plaestine because the "Bible says so". Well, there are two points that must be taken into account before such wrongful assumptions are taken. One, with the coming of the New Testament, the Old one was simply nullified and so was everything that came there beacuse the jews were such an "Obedient People". And two, anyone can produce and compose books of equal morality and legality sufficient enough to ask for the expulsion of the Portuguese or the Italians from their territories only because this book or that says so.
Furthermore, the new European Union Constitution takes into scrutinous account the Christian and Jewish heritage of Europe, which is sufficient leagal requirement to refute today' calims about jews being hated and expelled from Europe.

Quoting myself once again: I don't mean to put out the flame of optimism, but peace will most likely never be achieved.

Both sides are equally at fault. They both have rights to the land. If they can't get along, let them blow each other up and shoot each other. I'm sick of people complaining, "Poor Israelis! Those sadistic Arabs are taking up their land," or "Poor Arabs! Those damn Jews violently stole their land back.. again."

I totally agree. I mean there is no reason why they can't share the land. Take it from me;I have to share my stuff some like hair products for instants

All right, all right. i'm not gonna have this conversation on a message board. The Jews came after WWII, and the palestinians are now forced to live in the gaza strip and west bank. I don't think they, of all people should be treating the Arabs like that (no one should treat anyone like that.) If the land is taken, the land is taken, end of story. But whatever. I'm not gonna pursue this when it's going nowhere, buddy.


email: BurritoIzumi@msn.com
AiM: VvKoushirovV

-rito

It was Israel before it was anything else buddy, get ur facts right.
Its israel and u know what??toooo bad for u cos its gonna stay that way forever!!I mean do u really think all jews are just gonna get up and leave??what are u like mentaly retarded?

"Millions of people live there and they're not about to get up and leave cos some stupid arabs want it"

After WWII, the Jews in Europe didn't feel safe. They believed this to be reasonable cause to move to their 'homeland', Israel, and have the Palestinians leave, that and Israel being the ''promised land'' (when seen from another person's point of view, it isnt). So the Palestinians had to up and leave cause "some stupid jews" wanted it.
It's like us coming in and kicking the natives out. But what's done is done, and we can't change it, now can we?

-rito

Ok you guys are really starting to get on my nerves....ITs Israels land!!!!!!!!!!!
Millions of people live there and they're not about to get up and leave cos some stupid arabs want it...TOO FREAKIN BAD!
ITS ISRAEL AND THATS WHAT ITS GOING TO BE FOREVER.
THERE IS NO WAY IN HELL THAT IT'LL EVER CHANGE SO GET THAT THRU YOU'RE THICK HEAD AND SHUT UP.