I can now give a rational explanation of what I think about pollution.
Okay, so what if you're right and we aren't causing global warming?
Does that make pollution a good thing?
Does that make cutting down the rainforests a good thing?
The answer is that it can't possibly be a good thing.
If it's not a good thing, then it must be a bad thing.
And where are you getting all this stuff anyway?? You're saying that mankind isn't the cause of global warming well to be honest it's the answer that makes the most sense to me.
I've never heard any different… the majority of scientists seem to think so, and I think it makes sense.
Sorry for going mad, I've now realised that you might not be pro-cutting-down-rainforests after all and I might've misunderstood you as just saying that it doesn't cause global warming.
(However, if anybody here is pro cutting down rainforests, then you can be sure that given half a chance I will bash your head in with a wooden spoon).
Personally, I think it does, and even if it doesn't cause global warming then it's still terrible!
In my opinion, if there is a bigger cause for global warming, then we're certainly not helping with all our CO2 emissions adding to it, and if we are the cause, then we should be doing our best to remedy the situation.
Either way, I think President Bush should be trying to cut down on global warming. (By the way, if given half a chance I would bash his head in with a wooden spoon) and for anybody that wants to slag off Tony Blair, I'll tell you now that I'm not that fond of him either, in fact I can do a lot of the slagging off for you, he's too image-concious by far, and he never gives a straight answer, I don't like him so go ahead and be as rude about the english leader as you like in retaliation to my anti-bush spoonhitting comment.
penmagic

sorry, i just can't believe anyone could be so insensitive about rainforests being cut down.
They're beautiful!
I think you can see how passionate I am about this subject so I'd better stop before I get any angrier, otherwise my head might explode from the rage and that would make a horrible mess of brains all over my carpet.
YOU-
*Takes a deep breath and calms down before she says something horrifically impolite that would not be a very civilised thing to do at all*
Thanks for welcoming me as a british person. But I hope that you understand, Dr Strangelove, that if you don't change your mind about the value of beauty and preserving the untouched havens of the world… you are my sworn enemy, and given half a chance I would bash your head in with a wooden spoon.
I think… I'll go now.

penmagic- I agree with you that Global Warming is a problem, however the cause is in severe doubt. While there are thousands of scientists that say that CO2 is the cause, there are thousands on the other side that say there are other causes. Scientists can be wrong. IF you educate yourself on thier theories, have a rudimentrary understanding of the science involved, and look at it from all sides, you can form your own opinion. Not just listen to what one of the lab coats tells you. :/
In any case it's good to see another international person in here. If there was one big thing this site needs, it's more opinions from other countries outside of our media loop.

liltrumpetgurl- Drowings and freezings are not going to happen. Those are scare tactics. An ice age will approach slowly, and the possible sea level increase caused by gradual melting will flood cities at a speed that will allow us to evacuate safely and slowly. If we ever get to that point. Which brings me to the rest of my post.

Also, My example of the Volcanic CO2 emmissions was exactly that, CURRENTLY we are not putting out enough CO2 to acount for the temperature increases we are seeing. Back in 1900, the CO2 emmissions from America and Europe were 7 times higher than the combined CO2 output of all industrialized nations today. We are doing quite well with our current system of CO2 regulation.

And as for the sun/mars topic. You idea would be a viable solution had it not been occuring at the same time. World average temperatures have been on the rise for well over one hundred and fifty years now. However, in the past 10 years temperatures have spiked (reletively) without the (according to the CO2 theory) expected increase in emissions. The same has happened on Mars in the past decade. Temperature spikes, and the resulting meltdown at the poles.
And more on the sun: While the sun is constantly expanding as it burns out, it also swells and contracts, like a ballon you breath in and out of. I appears as if the sun is in one of these shorter expansion periods. The heat increase isn't just on Mars, it's also on Jupiter. The atmospheric storms, including the Great Red Spot, on Juptier are showing signs that things are getting hotter.

If you have one report it's possible.
If you have two reports it's probable
If you have three reports it's confirmed.

And still further: The cutting down of the rainforests is not affecting our oxygen or CO2 levels. There is a very interesting and credible study recently put out that suggest that the Amazon Basin (as you probably know is the largest block of rainforest in the world) is in CO2 equillibrium. This means it puts out about as much CO2 as it takes in.
This is possible because with the net intake of CO2 the trees take in, enough CO2 is diffused into the air from the Amazon river and it's many tributaries that it is effectivly cancelled out.

Please don't take this in the wrong way and think that I think the rainforests are open to clearcutting, but they aren't the key to our survival. The majority of our oxygen comes from algea photosythesis. I'd seriously like to read a bit on this algea reduction you are talking about. If you could direct me to some info on that i'd be very apreciative. All i've heard about is too MUCH algea caused by chemical fertilizer run-off, and various other reasons.

In any case you can see why I'm not irritated at President Bush for his decision to ignore Kyoto. There is simply not enough evidence to justify the billions it will cost.

you have to take into account that their werent humans cutting down trees and getting rid if algae

say that it wont effect you? Drowning or freezing in the next iceage doesnt bother you. Or maybe not us but your grandchildren drowning or freezing doesnt bother you?

And you also realize that there is not that much seismic or volcanic energy that big too often. There is the everday day little stuff but taht does produce that much.

And yeah, the sun is getting bigger but not that fast. Mars's heat fluctuations and ice caps melting, oculd also be caused by its own equivelent to an iceage too from global warming.

Hellooo?
Global warming does exist! You are idiots if you pretend it doesn't! And yes, mankind polluting the atmosphere is one of the main causes, although it can also be contributed to by volcanoes erupting.
Guess what? Scientists are intelligent people, how did you think they got all those PhDs? their job is not just to sit there in white coats looking clever. They know what they're talking about. Global warming is a fact of life… I thought everybody knew that!
But then again, I'm british so maybe the general view is different over in the states, I dunno, President Bush isn't exactly an environment lover.
In my view it's a problem that definitely needs to be sorted.

I can't believe Bushsupporter is making up conspiracy theories about liberals to shut down businesses, actually I can believe it. Yeah, Bushsupporter, my goal in life is to shut down businesses and strip your freedoms, and my device is global warming, how did you guess?

budwurm- While the sun is getting hotter, that is not the reason. The reason is the sun itself is expanding as it burns up it's nuclear fuel.

Aimee - for one thing the sun is getting hotter every minute we sit here and write these posts. its gravitational pull pulls in small meterites and things amking it hotter and hotter, thus every planet in the universe will do the same. there really is no use trying to stop something that produces more heat than every heater America combined. we need to be realistic and face the facts - its gonna happen.

Aimee- Some of those are facts, some of those are theories.
As for human vs. natural production of CO2 and other greenhouse gases, consider this: A few years ago when a volcano erupted violently near Italy, it was estimated that so much CO2 was released that it nearly equaled the entire industrial output of CO2 in the past 100 years.

The problem with many of those theories that you posted from the EPA is that they treat the Earth as a closed system. They also have not noticed that the sun is in a state of expansion, they have not noticed the same thing happening on MARS, where martian glaciers are receeding at drastic rates, and average martian temps have gone up 10 degrees since we started taking detailed records.

Question: Have CO2 levels risen enough to warrant these temperature changes? Are there other culprits?

Global warming IS real. Check out the EPA and what they have to say about it. Here is the information I learned from reading their stuff.
The greenhouse effect is a natural thing. It's a result of the atmospheric greenhouse gases (water vapor, carbon dioxide, and other gases) trapping the energy the earth radiates and retaining the heat. The greenhouse effect keeps us warm and the planet livable. The problem is when the concentration of the greenhouse gases is changed. Yes, they do change naturally, but humans have a much larger impact on them. And when an excess is naturally produced, excess is absorbed by the ocean and vegetation. Over the last century, world temps have risen from 0.5 to 1 degree, and sea level from 4-8 inches. If the emissions caused by human activity are not decreased, by the end of the century temps could rise up to another 10 degrees and sea level up to 10 feet more. Temperatures and eventually weather will change. That effects forests, crops, and water supply.
If uncontrolled it could lead to a great many problems in the future, some over the NEXT 50 YEARS, not so far down the road that we shouldn't care.

This is information I learned from the Environmental Protection Agency, a government agency. These are the facts.

I think that yeah it might be coming, but it doesn't really matter. For one thing it wouldn't affect us and if it won't affect you then why would you throw your life away trying to prevent it 50 years down the road? And another thing, it will eventually come when all of us are dead so theres no use prlonging the inevitable. You only are alive once so why would you waste your one and only life preventing something that will never affect you in any way? It just doesn't make sense to me.

I think there is global warming. For all the people who say there isn't, maybe you are right, all I know is that we still need to try to prevent it before it DOES come if it hasn't already.

Nadia

'It is not real. For evry scientist you find that says there is I can find you one that says there isn't. It is a great liberal ploy to shut down businesses and strip inividual freedoms.' - Bushsupporter

Give me proof that it does exsists, don't just say it does.

Marine16,
You don't seem to believe in very many things... like the addictive substances in cigarettes or global warming.

So, if you're not willing to believe in those, what ARE you willing to believe?

You are unwilling to except anything without proof. There is no proof for any thing on this planet! How do you know that life exists?

Maybe this is all a DrEaM?!?!?!

I don't mean to attack you... I'm just rather frustrated.

All I'm trying to say is that most of the things in this world are based on correlations.

We don't have time to prove global warming exists. We just have to make the best educated guess we can, and go for it.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Later gators,
Linnea

Many things you guys disagree with seem to be a "great liberal ploy", or something similar to that. Think of a better argument.

to add on to my prior statements, the whole in the ozone does exist and is getting bigger, that is normally not disputed, its causes are. the reason that the whole is getting bigger faster is because of flural carbons (florine and carbon mixed) florine is the most reactive element. Arasol cans use them but when they are in the lower atmosphere they are in a neutral bond (no charge). Once they get into the atmosphere there is enough pressure and radiation to make the chemical bonds to come apart and it gives off alot mroe radiation and forces reactions with other things (like O3). This isnt disputed, this happens, its simple chemistry. Weather this depletes the ozone in a big effect is diputed, but there werent arasol cans before humans

So have you been around on earth since its creation? The earth goes through changes in temperatures much like the weather does day to day only over hundreds and thousands of years. Was it man that cause the ice age too then? Or the dinosaurs to become extinct? No and again no. Of course global warming is real but not to the extent that people are saying that has been caused by mankind.

How can you people think that Global Warming is not real? It is a serious problem that we as a nation, and people of Earth have to face. There is significant proof that the temperature of the earth has risen, and that holes in the ozone layer are growing. All of you crazy people out there who don't believe this had better take another look. It's people like you, who support our crappy president Bush, that are ruining the planet.

I am not even going to dignify this myth know as 'global warming' with a response.

Bushsupporter hit the nail on the head, 'It is not real. For evry scientist you find that says there is I can find you one that says there isn't. It is a great liberal ploy to shut down businesses and strip inividual freedoms.'