With all the millions of people out there, the propaganda machines have defined political views into three succint categories: liberal, conservative and moderate.

Well, I think for one that that model is bogus, because like I said, there are millions of people.

But see, the plan is working; in order to get everyone's mind off of the step-by-step dismantling of our country, we have to keep the sheeple occupied; give them tons of sports, tons of "entertainment" news and have them bicker over liberal vs. conservative issues; oh, and indoctrinate the kids in "free public schools."

You've just breeded a complete nation of ignorance and stupidity by doing this, but the guys in power planned it that way and it's working beautifully.

See, you have to have patience and understanding to realize this whole thing, thank God!

Because if everyone know these world powers' plans, we wouldn't be in a state of complete destruction here in America.

Still, liberal as in the adherence to the Communist Manifesto should be stripped as a tag and just labeled Communist.

But because "conservatives" are also politically correct and do not want to invoke McCarthyism, they stick to liberal labels. But eh, I'm not a conservative (I'm a libertarian).

Anyway, if you're a subscriber to Communist ideas, then you're a Communist. Case closed.

Thank you Kitty! *kisses feet* Someone who makes sense!

Personally, I tend to be liberal. But that doesn't mean I agree with everything the left wing does or says and vise versa for the right wing. Why does everyone want to label what they think? Labels like 'Democrate' and 'Republican' represent different vaules for different people.

To some people 'liberal' means communist, and other some people 'conservative' means greedy old rich white guy. Both can be true, but aren't usually. There's a large diverse population of both, and just because someone votes one way or another doesn't mean they agree with EVERYTHING that politican or group of politicians think.

As far as the term 'liberal' being insulting, who really cares? Call me anything you want, it's your opinon and this is America. Freedom of speech and all that good stuff. I guess what I'm really trying to say is, not every group is any one thing. Not all liberals are anti-patriotic granola crunching nut jobs, and not all conervatives are tight fisted out of date control freaks. =)

You idiots, do you not see what I am saying?

In England, liberal means the exact opposite of what it means in America.

Liberal in America means an adherence to Communism; if you were to come to Texas and just openly say, "I'm a liberal," people would associate you with: abortion rights, gun control, environmentalism, political correctness, feminism and all the other issues that Communists espouse.

Socrates, you're an admitted Communist, I'm proud of your honesty.

But no, you cannot say conservatives are all Nazis, because there's - quite frankly - not a dime's worth a difference between a modern-day liberal and a modern-day conservative, except in maybe economic terms.

Inky, if you're going to be talking about liberal in the classic sense, call them libertarians. Libertarians and classical liberals are the same thing.

Liberal meant something COMPLETELY different 20, 30 years ago as opposed to now.

Get that straight, please.

The policies of Marx and of the Communist Manifesto are not "smart" Socrates. You're a devout Communist and that makes you pretty much an Enemy in my view.

You're more than welcome to spout off your misguided and failed views, but this is America; we were built on free enterprise and individual liberties; you obviously do not agree with that because of your strongly-held Communist views.

And people, please, don't try to tag me a "McCarthyist" as some sort of demonization. It's not going to work. You can call me a Goldwaterite too, but that's not a put-down. Just face it, each and every one of you; if you subscribe to the planks of the Communist Manifesto, you are a Communist.

Pure and simple.

And if you don't like being labeled a Communist, then don't hold on to Communist views.

The Political Compass is English-made, so their definitions and America's definitions vary greatly.

On the political compass, I am (-3.5,-3.85) with the X axis being the extreme left at -10 going up to the extreme right, and the Y axis being extreme authoritarianism at +10 going down to extreme Libertarian.

The extreme left is communism, the extreme right is neo-liberalism, the extreme authoritarian is fascist, the extreme libertarian is anarchist.

I'm a moderate left moderate libertarian.

Incidentally, Joey, I think you have a warped idea of what communism is.

That's what I said near the beginning. Apparently certain McCarthyists don't pay atention. At least not to me. Hopefully you are better at getting such people to listen than I am.

Hmm, just realised I've learned a lot since my original post... I was confusing liberal with left wing too. Thanks political compass.

Liberal cannot be the same as communist.
Communists argue that everybody should follow a certain way of living that is supposed to be 'for the good of the people'. It's about conforming, about everybody having the same rights because they live very similarly. Communist governments end up authoritarian, because they strictly control the people.

Liberals are for the freedom of the individual to act as they please- the opposite of authoritarian ideas. Therefore liberal is not at all the same as communist (which wants people to conform, not follow their individual wishes).

Extreme liberalism would be disastrous, as there would be no laws to live by.
Extreme authoritarianism is also bad, because people are too strictly controlled to be able to follow their individual wishes and be happy.

Liberalism is unrelated to left and right politics. You can be a right-wing or left-wing liberal.

Hope I've made my point.

All Liberals are Communists. So all Conservatives must be Nazis. Why don't you come visit me? That way I'll kill you like the commies did to the Nazis in WWII, and neither of us will have to listen to the other spouting off ridiculous anti-freedom crap.

quote:

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Just look at this country; there are "free schools," "free health care," an income tax, more taxes out the butt that you can even count, no private property rights, etc.

---

1)Free schools. Yes, there are. Would you prefer we go back to 5% of the population graduating from high school and the rest working menial jobs on a farm or in a factory? Move to China; it's a lot like that there.
2)Free health care? Hardly. My mom almost died a couple years ago from a rare disease similar to flu. She'll probably die before she pays off the medical bills from that.
3)Yeah, we have an income tax. Guess who doesn't? Mozambique, because the people there have no income to tax.
4)More taxes than you can count. Then maybe you need to take advantage of the free schooling you were complaining about above. We actually have very low tax rates. If you want to know high taxes, spend some time in Russia. Under the commie liberals, the gov't took 90% of your income. Now the gov't takes 50% and the mafia takes the other half.
5)no private property rights? If by this you mean stealing is illegal, yeah, we don't have the right to other people's private property. But I know my grandparents own 150 acres of the most valuable farmland in east Tennessee, and if anyone comes on that property without permission my grandfathger is legally allowed to use his shotgun on the poor *******. Sounds like private property rights to me!

Apparently Communists are smarter than Nazis.

quote:

---

I reckon people that automatically associate 'liberal' with 'communist' don't know anything about political definitions.

---

You're wrong.

In the United States, people with the "liberal" positions, and by liberal I mean current 21st Century definitions (pro-choice, pro-gun control, pro-public schools, pro-universal health care, etc.), hold on to Communist ideas.

Ten Planks of the Communist Manifesto are working now; how is this? Why is this?

Liberal is just another one of those "bad" words the anti-communists tagged the communists; it's not wise to invoke liberal-hating McCarthyism again, so the word "liberal" was and is used.

Liberal means communist; you're in denial if you think that.

Just look at this country; there are "free schools," "free health care," an income tax, more taxes out the butt that you can even count, no private property rights, etc.

To say this is any different than Communism is to A) prove you are stupid, and B) proves you're in Communist denial.

The Political Compass: My Questions and Answers

1. If economic globalization is inevitable, it should primarily serve humanity rather than the interests of transnational corporations. --- Strongly disagree. If corporations can’t serve people properly they will face government or public backlash.

2. I'd always support my country whether it was right or wrong. – Strongly Agree, I’d do anything to help my country (that does not mean that I unquestionably support my government).

3. No one chooses their country of birth, so it's foolish to be proud of it. --- Strongly disagree; The USA currently is the most powerful nation on earth, I’m proud to be a part of it.

4. Some racial groups are inherently superior to others. -- Strongly disagree. Racism is one of humanity’s greatest evils.

5. The enemy of my enemy is my friend. – Strongly Agree. Often times this is the case, for better or worse. But the USA should make it clear that any support of or from dictatorships is only temporary.

6. Military action that defies international law is sometimes necessary. -- Strongly agree. Do we really trust the bureaucrats and appeasers at the UN to seriously handle world affairs?

7. The growing fusion between information and entertainment is a worrying contribution to the public's shrinking attention span. – Strongly Agree. Americans are getting lazy, fat and ignorant. This isn’t anti-Americanism, it’s the sad truth.

8. People are more divided by class than nationality. – Strongly disagree, but holds some merit. There are however certain cultural differences that thus far overshadow class differences.

9. Controlling inflation is more important than controlling unemployment. --- Strongly agree, since having an income is meaningless if it loses its value due to inflation

10. Corporations cannot be trusted to protect the environment. – Strongly Agree. We can’t trust the public to do much against corporations.

11. From each according to his ability, to each according to his need is a fundamentally good idea. --- Strongly Disagree. This is idealistic Marxist nonsense, and ultimately it fails when it’s used as a foundation for societies.

12. it’s a sad reflection on our society that something as basic as basic as drinking water is now a bottled consumer product. --- Strongly disagree. If someone is intelligent and clever enough to market something so common as bottled water and make a profit, is a sign that the USA isn’t completely full of stupid people (as so many believe).

13. Land shouldn't be a commodity to be bought and sold. -- Strongly disagree. If people want it, they should go out and pay for it! You can’t just take things without asking or paying for them!

14. Many personal fortunes are made by people who manipulate money and contribute nothing to society. – Strongly Agree. There are a lot of people who don’t really deserve as much money as they make. Not to mention all the crooked executives or sweat shop owners in American business.

15. Protectionism is sometimes necessary in trade. – Strongly Agree. We must keep our industry and companies strong.

16. The only social responsibility of a company should be to deliver a profit to their shareholders. – Strongly Disagree. Companies should be obligated to do something to help communities or their country.

17. The rich are too highly taxed. -- Agree. The rich are not a stable source of income, as they can lose money or move overseas. Plus, high taxation and or redistribution of wealth destroy incentive in workers to succeed. With that said, I still think a graduated tax system should be in place.

18. Those with the ability to pay should have higher standards of health care. – Agree, but only because it’s impossible to get socialized health care to work as well as privatized care. I do think we need Medicare to help the poor out in getting insurance to pay for health care though.

19. Governments should penalize businesses that mislead the public. – Strongly Agree. I want to know what I’m buying; if you lie to me and I lose money should lose money too.

20. The freer the markets, the freer the people. -- Strongly disagree. Under a “free” market we’re free to lose jobs overseas, free to have pollution, free to have exploitation of the third world, and free to have crooks like Arthur Anderson. Some freedom we have under our “free” market.

21. Abortion, when the mother's life is not threatened, should always be illegal. -- Strongly Agree. The fetus is developing human life form separate of the mother, not a body part like some people claim. As such, its right to live should be allowed so long as it does not threaten the life or the mother.

22. All authority must be questioned. -- Strongly disagree. Some questioning is pointless, and often times the motives of those in charge are nearly impossible to find out. That said people should try to reform authority if they think it’s out of control.

23. An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth. – Strongly Agree. The punishment should fit the crime.

24. Taxpayers should not be expected to prop up any theatres or museums that cannot survive on a commercial basis. --- Agree. Let the public decide whether something survives or not!

25. Education should involve enabling children to develop their own personality. – Strongly Disagree. People should do this on their own, not with some vaguely socialist “feel good” education.

26. Everyone has their rights, but it is better for everyone if some people stick to their own kind. -- Disagree. What’s the implication here, that social segregation of people is a good thing? The only people who should be separated from the rest of society are the bigots who believe in such a thing.

27. Good parents sometimes have to spank their children, to teach them wrong from right. -- Strongly agree. If a child does something wrong, they should expect some punishment.

28. It's natural for children to keep some secrets from their parents. – Strongly Disagree. What would kids be hiding to begin with, other than something bad?

29. Marijuana should be legalized. -- Agree. Drug laws are costly and ineffective (outside of creating a black market and turning a health problem into a crime problem). We should regulate drugs and tax them with a vengeance.

30. The function of schooling is to equip the future generation with jobs. -- Strongly agree. What else would they be for? Socializing? “Self-Esteem”? Please, this sort of sentiment is one of the reasons schools are so dismal in this country.

31. Significantly disabled people should not be allowed to reproduce. Disagree. What they do is their own business, so long as they are capable of caring for themselves or their family.

32. The most important thing for children to learn is to accept strong discipline. -- Strongly agree. If people can’t learn restraint and responsibility, they are useless to our society.

33. There are no savage or civilized people, there are only different cultures. -- Strongly disagree. Cultures that are theocracies, slave trading, blatantly misogynist or have any other sort of evil that has long since been resolved in the west are clearly savage ones.

34. Those who are able to work and choose not to, should not expect society's support. -- Strongly agree. If you can work but decide not to, then why should people encourage your laziness?

35. When you are troubled, it is better not to think about it, but to keep busy with more cheerful things. -- Strongly agree (with the exception of mental problems).

36. First generation immigrants can never be fully integrated within their new country. -- Disagree. Some immigrants such as my mother are more than capable of integrating into their country.

37. What's good for the most successful corporations, is always, ultimately, good for us. –Agree. They don't succeed unless we buy from them and invest in them. Also, they’re business practices with some exceptions are successful ones which probably all businesses should emulate.

38. No broadcasting institution, no matter how independent in its content, should receive public money. – Strongly Disagree. If a station needs public money to survive, that’s its business.

39. Social freedom should be the priority of govt. – Strongly disagree. Some “freedoms” like abortion, illegal immigration (without contribution to society), speech with criminal intent (i.e. terrorism) and other things are dangerous. Civil rights are a much more important priority for the government.

40. A significant advantage of a one party system is that it avoids the arguments that delay progress in a democratic political system. --- Strongly Agree. That’s also the reason why one-party systems have so much corruption as well, as they have absolutely no opposition to keep them in line outside of a few reformers (ex: Gorbachev) or dissidents who are often murdered or exiled.

41. Although electronic surveillance makes official surveillance easier, only wrongdoers need be worried. -- Strongly Agree, but street cameras are an Orwellian violation of personal freedoms. Instead, people should have compulsory ID cards.

42. The death penalty should be an option for the most serious crimes. -- Strongly agree. Again, the punishment should fit the crime.

43. In a civilized society, one must always have people above to be obeyed and people below to command. -- Strongly agree. Every group needs a leader.

44. Abstract art that doesn't represent anything shouldn't be considered art at all. – I refuse to answer this one as I believe no one can say what is or isn’t art, and that it’s also irrelevant to politics.

45. In criminal justice, punishment should be more important than rehabilitation. – Strongly Agree. When you commit a crime, you should face consequences. Prevention of future crimes by the criminal should come secondary, though it is very much important.

46. It is a waste of time to try to rehabilitate some criminals. -- Strongly agree. Serial Rapists, Murderers, Drug Lords and Gang Leaders are almost never rehabilitated successfully.

47. The businessman and the manufacturer are more important than the writer and the artist. ---- Strongly agree. We need businesses and manufacturers in order for civilization to exist. We need writers and artists in order for our entertainment and intellectual stimulation. The latter though pleasant is less important than the survival of mankind.

48. Mothers may have careers, but their first duty is to be homemakers. -- Strongly agree. Households need to have someone watching and raising their children, whether it’s the mother, father, relatives or close friends. Out of all those however generally the mother is more suited to raising her own kids.

49. On environmental issues, thinking globally and acting locally is basically a good idea. – Strongly Disagree. It’s the other way around, especially when dealing with developing countries which may need laxer environmental laws in order to industrialize (and subsequently pursue more environmentally friendly technology).

50. Making peace with the establishment is an important part of maturity. -- Strongly agree. We need reformers, not radicals.

51. Astrology explains many things -- Strongly agree. Astrology seems to have some basis on reality, and in general I believe that it should hold some importance in society.

52. Religion and morality are closely linked. – Strongly agree. More often than not, people need moral guidelines in their lives, and that takes the form of religion. Studies have shown that often times decreases in Crime Rates in American society correlate with religious revivals.

53. Sex outside of marriage is usually immoral. – Strongly Agree. Abstinence is both more economical and moral. Plus, sex shouldn’t be a commodity like society makes it into these days.

54. Charity is a better than social security in helping the disadvantaged. – Strongly Agree. Charity normally helps only those who truly need it, whereas welfare sometimes helps those who do not truly need it.

55. Some people are naturally unlucky. -- Strongly agree. Some people just draw misfortune to them.

56. Faith based schools have a positive role to play in our educational system. -- Strongly agree. We need more discipline and classical education in our school systems. If that takes the form of Catholic Schools, then so be it.

57. A same sex couple, in a stable loving relationship, should not be excluded from adoption. – Strongly Disagree. I have nothing against homo-sexuals, but I think that it may be too much for a child to handle if they have gay parents. People would likely harass them day and night over their parents, and there would be a serious backlash against gays (especially in a country which overwhelmingly doesn’t even think that Civil Unions should be allowed, let alone marriage).

58. Pornography, depicting consenting legal adults, should be legal for the adult population. –
Strongly Disagree. Some adults (such as sex offenders) with mental problems or criminal records I think shouldn’t have access to pornography. Otherwise I think porn should be allowed for the adult public, though I don’t approve of it at all.

59. What goes on in a bedroom between consenting adults is no business of the state. -- Strongly disagree. What about Bigamy? Incest? Sex that transmits STDS? Illegal prostitution? I rest my case.

60. No one can feel naturally homosexual. -- Strongly agree. There’s just too much of a social stigma on it, so people who are gay likely will never feel normal. Or else if they do they’ll worry about the wrong people “finding out”.

61. It’s fine for a society to be open about sex, but these days it’s going to far. -- Strongly agree. These days, promiscuity is more or less expected of people. That’s just hedonistic.

My political compass: Total Score
Economic Left/Right: 2.38
Libertarian/Authoritarian: 7.38

I am Almost perfectly moderate! lol.

Just slightly to the authoritarian left.



love Being moderate... I get to critize everyone.

Political compass rocks!

Well ok, maybe not rocks, but it's interesting and the people who made it obviously know what they're talking about.

I'm placed in the middle of the left/liberal quadrant. What I expected really…

Go there, it makes some really good points about political definitions as well as helping you know where you stand.

political compass

With the exception of the Fundamentalist or Reactionary Right I don't think that’s necessarily true of all Conservatives. Conservatives in general believe that there should always be strong moral convictions and standards, but they aren't always simple minded or ideologues. Many of them do recognize that they have to sacrifice things or take a pragmatic view on the world, especially in regards to War and other serious issues (the idea of Realpolitik has always had many adherents in the Right for instance). For these reasons, we should keep in mind that there are a fair number of moderates and cynics on the right, as there are on the left and virtually every other political group out there.

no gray areas. Looking at it from a psychological standpoint, conservatism stems from a desire not to have hray areas, to have easy answers for everything. In some instances this is good. When you're deciding whether to cheat on your spouse, the moral answer should be obvious to you. In others, such as stereotyping liberals as communists and itself as the world's salvation, conservatism fails.

I reckon people that automatically associate 'liberal' with 'communist' don't know anything about political definitions.

I see myself as liberal, or in any case being on the political left, because I think that it is important to take an interest in other people's and the planet's welfare- not to be selfish and just look after yourself, which is more of a conservative approach- and I am for people being able to do as they please as long as it does not hurt others… To be 'free' in what they do. Strangely enough liberal stems from the word liberty, is it such a bad thing to support?

Communism on the other hand, is really more like a dictatorship, because a government is deciding what they think the people want, which often isn't what the people actually want. It almost always turns into a big economic and political mess full of contradictions about what it actually IS, it ends up being a paradox "All people are equal but some people are more equal than others." -Animal Farm by George Orwell.

I'm pretty sure I'm a liberal… But I'm definitely not a communist!

-Pen

So in America, the Right is one great plain of different views and political standpoints, whereas the Left is like a cliff you fall off into Communism?

Is there no concept of grey areas?

Bex

Ironic name when it's taught from such a biased perspective. Complain to your principal, schoolboard, or whoever else is in charge of this. I have some friends whose social studies teacher got fired for organizing anti-war protests on his own time; surely someone who forces her opinion on others can be fired.

In a nutshell for people who don't know "Political stuff" Here is the political spectrum for you.



Conservative:
* Government control of the economy should be minimal. Equal opportunity and legal business practice should be guaranteed though. (Fiscal/Economic)
* Strong moral definitions should be held. Strict criminal law and sentencing are necessary. Freedom and rights cannot be compromised. A strong emphasis is placed on the individual (Moral/Social)

Libertarian:
** Government control of the economy should be minimal. (Fiscal/Economic)
* As long as actions do not harm others, they should be legal. Freedom and rights cannot be compromised (Moral/Social)

Moderate:
- The moderate tends to stand with different groups on an issue to issue basis. Some moderates have strong leanings in regards to certain ideologies in partial areas such as moral conservatism and economic liberalism.

Liberal:
* Strong government involvement and regulation of the economy. Redistribution of wealth and strict regulation of business by the government. (Fiscal/Economic)
* As long as actions do not harm others, they should be legal. Loose Constitutional interpretation. The society is emphasized. (Moral/Social)

Communist:
** Complete government involvement and regulation of the economy. Redistribution of wealth is a key. The government owns, runs, and controls all business. (Fiscal/Economic)
* The ends justify the means. All is done for the good of "society." In practice traditional morals are replaced by loyalty to the government and what the communist party dictates. Traditional Marxist ideas include dissolving the family unit. Actions are done supposedly in the "interest of the people" by the government. (Moral/Social)

Notice anything simular with Liberalist and Communist?