Much like the Vietnam or Korean war. Humiliating campaign on both occaisions.

The fall of an empire is directly related to not its technological advancement, but the technological backwardness of its neighbors. If a nation with the power of the Roman Empire, both economic, militeristic, and technological were to exist today, it would be a backward race of paupers, probably dominated by a colonial nation or consumed in civil war. All you have to be is better than everyone else to dominate, and we were for a while. Now, America has stopped advancing technologically, and the rest of the world is catching up and consuming it. It is a pattern troughout history: the Hittites fought the first stalemate war of Egyptian history, because it was the first time Egypt had ever fought against a nation of equal sophistication. The Romans fought the Parthians for generations, and niether could win until a pwerful outsider, the muslims, destroyed Parthia. And then there is the state of Mexica (the aztec) which was a great power that conquered much of central Mexico in the 15'th century, but fell in about a year to a more advanced society (the Spanish)

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What other country has become the sole global superpower in less than 220 years of existance?

I can also say that the UK, from its coming into existence from the time of 1707 when Scotland accepted entry into the Union, became the largest empire the world will ever know, incorporated 1/4 of the worlds land and never lost a major war.

If we count 1945 as the time of decline for the empire, we get 238 years. As for being the sole superpower, it took much more to be on top of the world when you were facing other such huge empires of the time. International conditioning has today meant a retreat from imperialism, something which passed America by.

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How is advanced weaponry not an incredible achievement? America has been around for less than 1/5 of of the time these Empires ruled, and yet we hold more influence over the world than Caeser could have every imagined.

The American empire is in decline, and will fail to hold onto the empires as long as Rome and Alexander etc managed to, through military, political and strategic administritive genius. If you want to question the decline read Colossus by Niall Ferguson.
The huge increases in technology the Romans achieved to allow them to conquer and control the whole meditteranean far outstretch American achievment. Don't forget your whole advanced weapons program was started by German scientists.

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What other country produces 6.6 tons of greenhouse gases per person per year?

What other country makes so much money from its businesses that it can afford to send an entire naval battle group & 10,000 Marines to foreign nations while enveloped in its own war?

Failure to sign up to Kyoto just shows how America isn't a Liberal peace loving country it thinks it is. Embrace the multilateral community you set up! and stop acting like a little brat with a big gun.


America is not unique. Empires have come and gone that were much larger and forged under much harder circumstances. Don't forget the US is the child of Britain. And remember empires such as the Ottomans, 1453-1918. During which they brought the known Christian world to its knees and conquered the entire middle east, Arabian peninsula, north Africa, Greece the Balkans the Causacus, Crimea, Moldova, Romania Wallachia, Hungary cyprus and crete and knocked on the door of Vienna. perhaps the US is scared of Islam because of its history? hmm, probably not heh.

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I thought that you sought to take religion out of political debating here.

I am attempting to argue on your terms here. You obviously won't try to see it my way, so I'm trying to see it your way.

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How is advanced weaponry not an incredible achievement? America has been around for less than 1/5 of of the time these Empires ruled, and yet we hold more influence over the world than Caeser could have every imagined.

True achievement is conquering an area twice the size of the United States with around 50,000 troops armed with bronze weapons as did Alexander the Great. And again, the sole reason America holds sway over the rest of the world is its weapons, and its threat of using them. You should read up on Alexander some time. A fascinating man.

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Originally posted by clpo13:
What other country has a national debt of over a trillion dollars?

Law of economics, like laws of nature, cannot be changed. Defecit spending is often necessary, especially in a time of world war.

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What other country produces 6.6 tons of greenhouse gases per person per year?

What other country makes so much money from its businesses that it can afford to send an entire naval battle group & 10,000 Marines to foreign nations while enveloped in its own war?

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What other country tries to fix the problems of the rest of the world when it still has rampant crime at home? Didn't your vaunted Jesus once tell you to remove the plank from your own eye before you go around taking the speck out of your friend's eye?

I thought that you sought to take religion out of political debating here.

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But I digress. And now I shall point to Assyria, Egypt, Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome for true great powers. The US is the a global superpower today simply because of advanced weaponry, not actual achievement. The US has been around a little over 200 years. Egypt and Rome have been around for thousands.

How is advanced weaponry not an incredible achievement? America has been around for less than 1/5 of of the time these Empires ruled, and yet we hold more influence over the world than Caeser could have every imagined.

What other country has a national debt of over a trillion dollars? What other country produces 6.6 tons of greenhouse gases per person per year? What other country tries to fix the problems of the rest of the world when it still has rampant crime at home? Didn't your vaunted Jesus once tell you to remove the plank from your own eye before you go around taking the speck out of your friend's eye? But I digress. And now I shall point to Assyria, Egypt, Babylon, Persia, Greece, and Rome for true great powers. The US is the a global superpower today simply because of advanced weaponry, not actual achievement. The US has been around a little over 200 years. Egypt and Rome have been around for thousands.

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Originally posted by clpo13:
Now, it seems that my original question hit a tender spot because no one answered it. I'll ask again: why is America the "greatest" nation on Earth?

What other country has become the sole global superpower in less than 220 years of existance?

I would also like to note that the "American Pride or the Gallows" attitude is more rural. I do not encounter it as much in ritzy suburbia as in, say, the midwest. In blue collar areas like Lodai, for example, there is a huge amount of fervent patriotism (I pride myself in never having been to Lodai) rich areas like the Hamptons are less likely to be like that. Cities like NYC (I have found) do not have any of this sort of intolerance. People tend to be more educated, and be more metropolitan in their tastes and ideas. Risky, our government is feeding into the bigotry and xenophobia shared by about half the population of the USA by encouraging it and showing itself as the ultra-American divinity. If you have ever read Lord of the Flies, its like Jack. If you haven't, pick up a copy and see how he acts with the "beastie." it is the same exact thing as what Bush does with the Trade Center and Terrorism. i will say no more in a public foruii alacanderii as the Fantasians call it.

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Originally posted by riskbreaker86:
Thats a very interesting argument. The kind of thing I was wwanting to know. Prior Cold War, especially around WW1 America had been very quiet internationally. Perhaps their emergence as a superpower and the responsibilities that came with that, forced the government to adopt policies which created strong American sentiment and fierce patriotism.

actually we were up Mexico's *** prior to the civil war, but that was not a real national war which spurred patriotism. The war of 1812 did, though. in the late 1800's, we became a colonial power, and that is when "Americanism" as a fervent ideal was instilled into the nation with all its trappings of racism and hatred. Immediately before and after WWI and WWII, we were facing nations who we couldn't toss aside quickly and easily, so we were afraid. That is why we didn't enter those particular wars quickly. If it had been Cuba, it would have been scourched earth. However, in the 1910's, we thought we were better than everyone else, and the nations of Europe and Asia could rot in hell as long as we were unaffected. It was kindof the "splendid isolation" Crystal Tower ideal.

First off, fascism is a form of statism, in other words big government. The government controls everything. However, it's closer (by a bit) to the definition of conservatism than to liberalism, especially in the lack of personal freedom department. Haven't you ever wondered why fascists are called extreme right-wing? Duh. And for the record, communism is extreme left-wing. Just so you know.

Now, it seems that my original question hit a tender spot because no one answered it. I'll ask again: why is America the "greatest" nation on Earth?

Conservatives are more apt to control the lives of citizens. Take the Patriot Act for example. Conservatives tend to support stricter censorship laws as do facsists. Liberals support more personal freedoms. Neither liberalism nor conservatism is directly linked with facism. I'm not trying to say that conservatism=facism by the way.

Conservatism is a mixture of Viagra-needing old-men ridden government, Bible kissers, girls with sewn genital areas and unshaved legs and armpits, families with 15 children, and legal female beatings.

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Originally posted by bluedemocrat:
Economically fascism is liberal. However, socially it is extremely conservative.

But that does not make it ultra conservative. Ultra conservativism is a combonation of limited government, moral social policies & free trade economic policies, none of which fascism contains.

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Wrong. Fascism is not ultra conservative, its authortarian liberalism. Look at their economic policies and then compare them to free trade (conservative) principles.

Economically fascism is liberal. However, socially it is extremely conservative.

What is so wrong with being patriotic? People should be proud of the country that they are from. America is a great country, It is not the greatest country however there is no "greatest" country. I love America mostly because of our gun laws and because of our military. But thats just me, after college i plan to join the rangers and help the men and woman fighting already.

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Originally posted by northstar316:
This is a sad trend of our nation, which could possibly lead to a hyper-conservative dictatorship like Hitler's regime.

Wrong. Fascism is not ultra conservative, its authortarian liberalism. Look at their economic policies and then compare them to free trade (conservative) principles.

Thats a very interesting argument. The kind of thing I was wwanting to know. Prior Cold War, especially around WW1 America had been very quiet internationally. Perhaps their emergence as a superpower and the responsibilities that came with that, forced the government to adopt policies which created strong American sentiment and fierce patriotism.

1950's anti-communism. I think that is where it really began in earnest, though un-americanism as a derogitory word was used in the 191-s. This nation is a post-democratic society, meaning, it is unacceptable to post views outside the norm. It is ok to say "bush is stupid" but if you put forth an actual complaint, logically organized and well built, then you are a terrorist, and deserve immediate liquidation. This is a sad trend of our nation, which could possibly lead to a hyper-conservative dictatorship like Hitler's regime.

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america isnt the 'greatest nation on Earth', it's just a nice place like many other countries are. every nation has something that sets them apart from everyone else, and this is what makes us ALL great and nations to be proud of. fierce patriotism blinds us to the real facts...it's a dangerous way to think. blind faith in leaders or governments or nations is never smart. it reflects ignorance and gives americans a bad name. marine 16 and reactionary...you guys are kind of, frankly, unrealistic.

this is fantastically put. True to the last word, bravo.

And clpo, i'm very anxious to hear the answers to your question. Why is it the best? there is nothing unique here that sets it apart from any other great country in history.

Being a member of riskbreaker's latter group (the sane one), I can't give an explanation for the "We're number one!" attitude that I see so often. The US is simply not the greatest nation on Earth.

But I have a question for the extreme patriots here: why is the US the best, in your eyes?

I think if we know the answer to that question, a great many things will fall into place.