Of course you should love your government! Especially one as good as ours. These moronic flag burners and anarchists all need a good taste of police brutality. Yuo should ALWAYS support your country (unless they start killing people or something), lack of support for countries leads to civil unrest, riots, etc. Flag burners and the like are just loserd hyped up on drugs with nothing to do and no future. I would love to see some vigilantees taking a stand and beating down these fools, that'd be great.

Just glad my abasement could bring you such joy.

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Okay, you've got me on that one. BillyBarrio, everyone, the SCATHING REALIST.

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God, that's great. LOL!

( so sorry if i'm distupting this personal feud between the two of you, but i decided in telling what i thought)
everything about this nation has changed. we went from everyone has free speech, say what you want , to oh we can't offend anyone please keep your opinions to yourself. sure we are allowed to bad-mouth presidents or our government but if we do we get backlashed by media and are basically thrown in exile because we stated what we thought. maybe the good ol' usa should stop trying to make everyone happy and being the perfect place to live and do what's RIGHT instead of what everyone wants. burning the flag shouldn't be considered such a wrong thing. what type of land is this if a piece of material is practically holy and stands for what we are?? I'm not sure i want to live in a place where a hunk of cotton should be my beliefs and my love. I rather love my country than my flag. Would i want to burn a flag? Not really, but if someone wants to, go ahead and do it. Nobody should get their panties in a bunch. Shouldn't we as a nation stand for all we love and hope for, instead of a manufactured flag? Oh and for the fact, buring the flag has nothing to do with hating the nation. It has to do with hating how the nation turned out or just hating the government. Isn't that basically what the flag stands for? The government, that tells us it doesn't rule our lives but is ready to shake their heads and tell us "no" when we do something that we want?

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You are so missing the whole point, no matter what I believe, you and I know adulthood is an elitist club. Why can't a 16yo vote? Why are we ignored and pushed aside when we disagree with our teachers? Why do police follow us around simply because we are teenagers? Yes I have been there and yes I understand all of these things you may not have a grip on yet. When you act out in ways that require no thought, like it or not...you are judged and proven guilty by those who run your life. Adults, Government and Law Enforcement will all have their eyes on you, and what you do as a teen or even an adult will change peoples view of you.

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Okay, you've got me on that one. BillyBarrio, everyone, the scathing realist.

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Am I so bad that I would like you and others to stop acting out and start using your minds? Anyone can burn a flag, but it takes a hero to change a nation. Am I wrong?

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You are not wrong in wanting me to use my mind. But you are wrong in saying that anyone can burn a flag. Do you think DesertEagle could ever burn a flag? No, because his loyalty to the nation is blind. He does not allow himself to see the negative aspects of our nation and its leaders (the conservatives, anyway). I agree that burning a flag is not and will never be sufficient to change anything that needs to be changed. My issue with flag burning is this: It seems to me that anyone who would take away my right to protest symbolically would also be willing to take away my freedom to "use my mind", as you say, or to protest "literally". I believe that destroying the right to symbolic protest is the first step toward destroying protest entirely, and it scares me.

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And what are your issues with this country, you didn't answer?

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Missed that the first time, sorry. Here are a few of my "grievances":
*I mistrust Bush's motives for war in Iraq
*I abhor his treatment of suspected terrorists and prisoners at Guantanamo Bay and within the U.S.
*we should withdraw from NAFTA and WTO
*we should repeal the Federal Reserve Act
*we should repeal the patriot act
*the war on drugs in our country needs to be seriously reevaluated, focused more on rehabilitation than ridiculously unfit punishment
*the Pentagon budget needs to be cut
*need to also reevaluate the drug war in South America

There're a few for you.

the amendmant probably wont pass but i wish it would. i see know real point in burning the flag except for the fact that your just showing signs of stupidity. if you really hate the US that much, why do you still live in it? get out if you hate it so much!!! so much that you have to stoop to the level of burning the flag, a flag that stands for hope and the unity of a country, a flag that stands for the men and women who died to give you the rights you have (maybe even the right to burn the flag... contradicting youself? i think so), a flag that means so much to so many people.

Flag burning should be LEGAL as long as it's not someone elses flag. If it's not hurting anyone then ok.

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Jesus Christ, you're 21 (or claim to be). Stop acting like adulthood is some elitist club, of conservatives no doubt, where membership finally renders your opinions valid.

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You are so missing the whole point, no matter what I believe, you and I know adulthood is an elitist club. Why can't a 16yo vote? Why are we ignored and pushed aside when we disagree with our teachers? Why do police follow us around simply because we are teenagers? Yes I have been there and yes I understand all of these things you may not have a grip on yet. When you act out in ways that require no thought, like it or not...you are judged and proven guilty by those who run your life. Adults, Government and Law Enforcement will all have their eyes on you, and what you do as a teen or even an adult will change peoples view of you.

Am I so bad that I would like you and others to stop acting out and start using your minds? Anyone can burn a flag, but it takes a hero to change a nation. Am I wrong?

And what are your issues with this country, you didn't answer?

Billy, you are acting like an absolute jerk, do you know that? You've prattled on and on and on and all you have managed to do is set forth unfounded judgements and fling inaccurate "insults". You say you're an adult; act like one.

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Acting out as an infant would is only proving to the populas that "children" are not able to conduct themselves in an adult manner.

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Jesus Christ, you're 21 (or claim to be). Stop acting like adulthood is some elitist club, of conservatives no doubt, where membership finally renders your opinions valid.

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I am sorry if you can't see your sub-urban angst and rebelion is getting you no where.

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Every idiotic parade against whatever it is to be cool against this week...

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But as of right now you worring about how cool you can look to your wannabe anarcho girlfriends is doing just what the Government wants you to do.

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when you are running around crying about how injust this country is and burning flags...

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Ladies and gentlemen, for my next trick... watch me pull a fully matured jackass out of a hat. I just wave my wand and say these magic words: "I do not burn flags." (I have never burned flags. I simply support others' rights to do so.) Voila.

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Yeah, that's right. The possibility of any change for anyone, anywhere, anyhow has been completely obliterated as a result of my "ignorance". Sorry, everyone. Well, at least that constitutional ammendment won't be happening.

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this is such a waste of time...why do I bother...hmm, oh yeah I actually do care about your rights and others. Acting out as an infant would is only proving to the populas that "children" are not able to conduct themselves in an adult manner. I am sorry if you can't see your sub-urban angst and rebelion is getting you no where. You aren't using your head, maybe you think "hey running through the street with a burning flag is going to get so much support for my cause", but it isn't. I can back this up in simple cases. Every idiotic parade against whatever it is to be cool against this week...at best has 300 thousand people at it. That's not a very big percentage of a country with almost 300 million residents.

You are a minority, a very vocal and loud minority but you are. And I do believe with some more schooling, some of you might change some laws...good or bad I don't know. But as of right now you worring about how cool you can look to your wannabe anarcho girlfriends is doing just what the Government wants you to do. Worry about the stupidity of the country, worry about burning flags and whatever silly issue you have. As long as your worried about silly issues...you won't be a threat to the important ones.

And you are right this country was founded on a Revolution and we have rights to protest and if need be revolt. Most of our founding fathers were revolutionists. So...not only are you burning my ideals, you are burning yours.

And I am so curious, when you are running around crying about how injust this country is and burning flags...what are the statements you are trying to get across, what are your issues with this country? Obviously it isn't neo-Nazism, since you didn't seem to care one bit after admitting you know there are neo-nazi sympathizers in our country? What is it...not racism...is it because we eat veal??? I gotta' know.

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I'm gonna tell you like I tell actual Nazi sympathizers. To wear a Swastika on your arm is to support something outside of this country, to support other ideals and politics.

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You think Nazism or neo-Nazism is or ever was completely "outside of this country"? American industrialists were the ones financially backing the Nazi party throughout the entire ******* Second World War. There have been Nazis and neo-Nazis in our country since the party was established. Open your eyes. Just because you couldn't register to vote under the Nazi Party in our country does not mean the idea wasn't alive here.

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To burn the flag is something I would expect of a Nazi as someone posted here a Nazi looking skinhead type guy burning the flag.

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Nazi Germany, as I'm sure you're well aware, imprisoned those who profaned the flag in any way. Your ideals are inspired by Nazi Germany; mine are inspired by those of America.

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I consider you the Nazi, you the enemy and you as thick headed and stupid as a nazi bonehead.

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I am the opposite of a Nazi. I am a proponent of the basic freedoms which all are entitled to, such as that of expression-- yes, whether you agree or disagree with what they have to say.

It's freedom of expression that allows you to parade your ignorance around in public, to call me "thick headed", "stupid", and "bonehead" for a mere difference in opinion. Treasure your rights, @sshole. And bow to me, because I'm the one fighting to preserve those rights.

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You lack inteligence to understand burning a flag is breaking a law.

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I understand perfectly well, you arrogant jackass. Not everyone worships unconstitutional laws. If you're talking about the law against burning in general, I'd be perfectly happy if law enforcement fined me. I'd pay up.

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If you do not like that law, then lobby congress to change the laws about burning within municipalities.

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Who's to say that I'm not already lending my support the the cause of changing the laws? However, it seems there's little point in pouring my time and energy into changing a law that is not enforced to begin with.

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I am sorry you are unable to have a thought process to allow you to actually prove a point to anyone, because I assure you...no one is listening to your point.

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The only reason I am unable to make a point to you is, as you so conveniently pointed out just now, that you aren't listening to begin with. And I don't think you've conducted any poll of the users on this board to know whether or not they are listening to me. You pulled that "fact" out of thin air in an effort to curb my response. Pathetic.

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You act as a if making some big fuss and burning stuff is proving anything to anyone...

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Of course it's not proving anything. It's not about proving facts, it's about expressing strong feelings. If you would read before "responding" (if you call it that) you would already know that.

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what you are proving is what this country and adults have always been saying. Children aren't smart enough to understand politics nor vote.

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Children, huh? What's the cutoff age? 21?

P.S. That's probably why children don't vote.

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You ruine any change that could ever be made for anyone through your own simple ignorance.

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ignorance (as defined by BillyBarrio): n. state of differing opinion or personally undesireable expression of such opinion

Yeah, that's right. The possibility of any change for anyone, anywhere, anyhow has been completely obliterated as a result of my "ignorance". Sorry, everyone. Well, at least that constitutional ammendment won't be happening.

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If you want to say that it's not peaceful because it upsets right-wing Nazis, then no form of protest is really legal, is it?

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I'm gonna tell you like I tell actual Nazi sympathizers. To wear a Swastika on your arm is to support something outside of this country, to support other ideals and politics. To burn the flag is something I would expect of a Nazi as someone posted here a Nazi looking skinhead type guy burning the flag. I consider you the Nazi, you the enemy and you as thick headed and stupid as a nazi bonehead. You lack inteligence to understand burning a flag is breaking a law. If you do not like that law, then lobby congress to change the laws about burning within municipalities. I am sorry you are unable to have a thought process to allow you to actually prove a point to anyone, because I assure you...no one is listening to your point. You act as a if making some big fuss and burning stuff is proving anything to anyone...what you are proving is what this country and adults have always been saying. Children aren't smart enough to understand politics nor vote. You ruine any change that could ever be made for anyone through your own simple ignorance.

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Yeah, who does it hurt to burn the flag? You know, I don’t like the government, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna go spray-paint obscenities on the war memorials in Washington. I'm going to go take a **** on the place where the twin towers used to be. I'm gonna go spit on the tomb of the Unknown Soldier. I'm not "hurting" anyone right? I'm just using my freedom to show how much I "love" this country...

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Your wit astounds me. There is a very real difference between destroying your own personal property (a flag that you own) and destroying public property, government property, or another person's private property.

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Flag burners hurt the entire country in their stupidity. They show how anti-American they are, and we shouldn’t have to stand for it.

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You have displayed nothing more or less than stupidity yourself in this thread and many others. You make Americans like myself hurt. Should we send you into exile for it?

When I burn a flag, it's not because I hate America and its ideals; it's because I srongly oppose its current policies or actions, war for example. It's because I want to make a statement and I don't feel like the government and its people are listening to me.

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Flag burners are the scum of society, and we need to do something about them.

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I would say the same about fascists.

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Has anyone noticed what countries do when they HATE the US? They burn our flag. Flag-burners are enemies of America and should be dealt with accordingly.

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Not everyone who burns a flag necessarily "hates" America. They do necessarily disagree with our country on issues. But doesn't everyone? They just happen to have a stronger expression of their dissent.

It seems to me that if anyone "hates" America, it is you. You are the one who despises the freedoms upon which this country is founded. You must hate America to the core if you hate freedom. Flag-burning isn't anti-American; fascism is.

You want to live somewhere where you'll never hear public outcry against the government? Hop a boat to Cuba. Good luck trying to find any that are headed that direction.

I personally think that burning the flag is wrong. That flag stands for everything that America has ever done, good or bad. And i asure you the good out ways the bad. I know so people think thats the only way for them to be heard and I understand that, but I think there is a better way.

Once again, you have an issue with something other than flag burning. You have an issue with a group of people that you make generealizations about.

THERE IS NO HARM IN BURNING A FLAG.

Yeah, who does it hurt to burn the flag? You know, I don’t like the government, you know what I'm gonna do? I'm gonna go spray-paint obscenities on the war memorials in Washington. I'm going to go take a **** on the place where the twin towers used to be. I'm gonna go spit on the tomb of the Unknown Soldier. I'm not "hurting" anyone right? I'm just using my freedom to show how much I "love" this country...

Flag burners hurt the entire country in their stupidity. They show how anti-American they are, and we shouldn’t have to stand for it. Flag burners are the scum of society, and we need to do something about them. Has anyone noticed what countries do when they HATE the US? They burn our flag. Flag-burners are enemies of America and should be dealt with accordingly.

There is nothing harmful or disruptive about burning a flag. Simple as that.

If you have an issue with crazy flag - burners who spray paint stuff and damage property, fine. But then your issue is with them, not the act of flag burning. If I was just standing on my property quietly, burning a small little flag, there is no reason you should have a problem with it, and there is no reason why I shouldn't be able to do that.

Billy, you have yet to explain to me how burning a flag is not peaceful. It may be destruction of property, but as long as it's one's own property, how is it not peaceful? If you want to say that it's not peaceful because it upsets right-wing Nazis, then no form of protest is really legal, is it? So what do you think the right to petition the government means? The right to petition as long as everyone agrees with what you're doing/saying? That would be pointless.

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We have bonfires and campfires and suchlike as often as we want them. We burn leaves in our ditches, farmers burn their fields. It's allowed. Not legal, maybe, but allowed.

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now that's funny...because what I posted...was the law from your state. Maybe someone should start making sure your town follows up on the laws...

And bonfires and this and that is not running into a street lighing stuff on fire. Farmers can not just set their fields on fire...they have safety measures and percautions they have to follow. Please, the other half of my family lives in Texas...I know how it works. I know you'd like to think these people all just run around burning stuff...but they don't.