The claim that animals have ?rights? was first put forward by the Australian philosopher Peter Singer in the 1970s and has been the subject of heated and emotional debates ever since. There are many contexts in which the question of ?animal rights? comes up. Should we farm animals? If so by what techniques? Should we eat animals? Should we hunt and fish them? Is it morally acceptable to use animals as sources of entertainment in the context of zoos, circuses, horse racing etc.? Often the same organisations that campaign on environmental issues (e.g. Greenpeace) are also concerned for the welfare of animals: both sets of concerns derive from a commitment to the value of Nature and the Earth. The question of animal rights might well come up in a debate on biodiversity, and is one with so many political and social implications that it is also worth having in its own right. This debate is about the ethical principles at issue; the separate debates on biodiversity, vegetarianism, zoos, blood sports, and animal experimentation deal with more of the concrete details.

That's a steryotype.

I hate it when people get mad that forests get developed. They are the same people who think its terrible that some people dont have houses or that they live out on the street, but get mad when some one tries to build a house by clearing a few trees and running off a squirrel or two.

A lot of the time it is our fault. Humans simply don't know how to handle wild animals anymore, how to act, what to do when encountering them. Attacks on ranches and cattle is us ivading their territory. Cougars attacking school students (which happened in my elementary school) is not us invading their territory. But the general public jus doesn't know how to handle it. And they love the woods. So they build more and more houses in prime forestland and what comes with the forest? Wild animals! Unfortunately we're building more and more houses, and developing more woods. Not only is it pushing back the natural habitat of the more ferocious beasts, but it's forcing them to try and understand that this isn't their land anymore, and they can't understand that. So what do you do when you encouter a cougar on a bike trail, or in your backyard? What do you do when there are three coyotes between you and your house? Not many people know. And ignorance is not excusable.

Misguided animal rights people. The kind who yell at you for eating a hamburger but say it's our fault animals kill us (even when we're not intruding in their territory). Thankfully, few think like this, but I've encountered a couple over time.

Who the hell calls it natural?

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What people are trying to do is instill equality, a right to live and not intrude on another's home.

But this is the problem. How is it fair to expect humans not to intrude on the lives of other animals but call it natural when a bear breaks into someone's house and mauls them? Isn't that violating the person's right to live?

Law..and the ideas of right and wrong are human inventions. Animals don't have them. They have no luxury to. Most live just to fight and survive. They have rules in each animal group. A pack must exist in a certain way. Disrupt order and you're either dead or exiled. A pride exists in a certain way... All of them do. What are humans but another group of animals making rules for themselves?

We're not elevating anyone to human status. To think that is just plain vanity. What people are trying to do is instill equality, a right to live and not intrude on another's home. Humans have "elevated" themselves so far most of them see themselves outside of nature, not as the animals they are. No one is going to let go of their pride to say that beasts are equal. No one is going to take a breath and say we're all connected. It's simply not going to happen.

The animal right movement will fail, simply because of the vanity of human beings.

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Polygamist leaders will banish the teenage boys from the colony for no specific reason, sometimes leaving them for dead out in the desert. They do this in order to give the older men a chance to marry the teenage girls.

Interesting. I've read stuff on polygamist groups, but I never heard of that sort of thing. Anyways, this kind of activity is still considered "wrong" in human society. If we're going to elevate animals to the same level as humans, we should expect that they not do this sort of stuff, either. That was the point I was making.

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Originally posted by clpo13:
dominant males will often kill infants that are not their own in order to limit challenges to their dominance.

Actually, there is a version of that which DOES go on in the human world.

I would recomend looking up "The Lost Boys of Polygamy" on the internet, as it is very similar to the infantcide that you have descibed.

Polygamist leaders will banish the teenage boys from the colony for no specific reason, sometimes leaving them for dead out in the desert. They do this in order to give the older men a chance to marry the teenage girls.

And to all of you who think that animals don't need rights, consider this:
Just because an animal cannot understand what we do, say or believe, does NOT mean that they cannot feel the pain that we infict upon them.

im really big into animal rights and protection. I hope problems are solved and actions occur so everything ends up happy for our furry little friends

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I dont hardly have enough money for rent and scarcely any for food. Yet I survive, how? I picked up another job. I can understand it if you are hunting for food and will use the animal you kill. I'm for that. However Im not for "sport hunting" where people try to see if they can get the "biggest buck"

Okay, cool. But in the future, don't group them all together in one term.

_{psst: "a lot" not "alot"}

seems like my posts are quoted alot. Its ok, I have this arguement alot. A lab rat is nothing like a human, you said

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Then why should I treat it like one?

because its common sense that all living life should be valued. Not whether or not it can talk, or whether or not its like us.

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If you hardly have enough money for rent, and less for food, how are you supposed to live?

I dont hardly have enough money for rent and scarcely any for food. Yet I survive, how? I picked up another job. I can understand it if you are hunting for food and will use the animal you kill. I'm for that. However Im not for "sport hunting" where people try to see if they can get the "biggest buck"

And no its not humane to take care of a dying animal while they are doing tests on it. Or rather its not that humane to even do tests on them. There are five different scientific ways THAT WORK that the UK has discovered and are now beginning to use instead of animal testing. Yet America has FLAT OUT DENIED using these tecniques. Yes I know I cant spell.

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a lab rat is nothing like a human

Then why should I treat it like one?

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On hunting animals. Its not fair to animals who are being hunted. Let me put you in the woods with no defenses.

Hunting is different than animal testing. They do have defenses. Deer have speed and woods-wise intelligence. Birds have flight and are small. The only kind of "hunting" that shouldn't be allowed is wolf hunting and the like. Running them down then shooting them when they can't move, or setting poison traps is unacceptable. But hunting is a way of life, and for some people a way of survival. If you hardly have enough money for rent, and less for food, how are you supposed to live?

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Make sure that they are taken care of while they die slowly because of medications runnign through their systems.

And that's...humane?

Its not certainly acceptable and it never will be. Let me stick a needle in your eyes and see if you find it acceptable then. Its not, it wont be ever. a lab rat is nothing like a human. Take a look at their biological set up. Its nothing like ours. And I do have a disease thats killing me.

Im a type 1 brittle diabetic. I still dont support animal testing. Theres enough of us diabetics that cant get our sugar under control that would LOVE to be in place of the animals. They should take volunteers.

But since the scientific society is sitting on their pompous butts and stabbing defenseless creatures then I will say this:

Treat the animals with respect. Put them in the Animal Welfare Act. Make sure that they are taken care of while they die slowly because of medications runnign through their systems. Make thier deaths a little easier on them, give them pain meds then too.

On hunting animals. Its not fair to animals who are being hunted. Let me put you in the woods with no defenses. I will disguise myself and then I will hunt you. Imagine the fear coursing through your system as you cant get away. (perhaps thats whats going on in Iraq, its human hunting. It really is if you think about it.)

The DNR are realeasing more and more animals into the wild and hunters are using this as an excuse to hunt more. Its sick. I agree with clpo13 we are invadingtheir land. Also its like with the indians, whites moved in and decided to take over them. (Im indian I know lol)

Also, I belive in only killing an animal if its tryuing to kill you.

2glz1boy brought up a good point, many lab animals are being used to find cures for deadly disease, and not to say that i particularly support all animal lab testing, but i believe that using animals in this way, to better the lives of man, is certainly acceptable.

I personally feel that eating animals (cows, pigs, chickens, ect. (not cats and dogs) ) is fine, as long as the animals are killed in a humane way.

I believe that the "experiment" question was asked at some point and my answer (my opinion) to that, in regaurd to say a lab rat, is that the expeiments done on them are often done to help better the lives of humans, learning how to treat disease. I think of it as though it were someone close to me, if one of my family members had a disease that was killing them and lab rat experiments could be done to find a cure and help them live then okay.

Because it's life, and causing pain to any life is sadistic.

Why? Why is it wrong? Elaborate, please.