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Registered: January 22, 2005
Posts: 716
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I have a personal belief that whatever you beleive will happen to you when you die, does. I would like some of your views on this and think that a lot can be gained from a debate like this. As a single practising Druid (I am not part of a group of Druids) I beleive that when i die i will go back to the realm of the soul for a while, then come back to earth, so that I can learn more of the meaning of existence.
Only simple and quiet words will ripen of themselves. For a whirlwind does not last a whole morning, nor does a sudden shower last the entire day.
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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But that's the thing. You don't knowwhat is. You don't even know if the "is" is never changing. I would rather think that mankind has never been sure than assume that we're right about the simplest of things, like the face that reality never changes.
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 166
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quote: Why? Why can't one be true for someone and another be true for someone? Or if the idea of two realities coexisting is too freaky for you, how about this: religion is just the admittance of another reality. So if you do good in this reality, or whatever your religion tells you to do to get beyond Earth, you will reach the other reality where everything you believed is true.
I'm sorry that you would rather think about what could be instead of what is.
When God speaks, reason must be silent. - Martin Luther
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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Why? Why can't one be true for someone and another be true for someone? Or if the idea of two realities coexisting is too freaky for you, how about this: religion is just the admittance of another reality. So if you do good in this reality, or whatever your religion tells you to do to get beyond Earth, you will reach the other reality where everything you believed is true.
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 166
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that is what you seem to be saying, or at least thats the way i see relativity. either way if those were the only two possible realities then one would have to be true and the other not
When God speaks, reason must be silent. - Martin Luther
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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So I could be a short, balding, 54-year-old man living in a small German town and work for the government with no access to the internet, despite me seeing myself as a 14-year-old American teenage female debating reality?
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 166
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quote: And my point is that how do you know what reality is? How do you know it doesn't change? How can you prove anything?
reality is what actually is, it changes with time, but what is real is real regardless of how we see it
When God speaks, reason must be silent. - Martin Luther
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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And my point is that how do you know what reality is? How do you know it doesn't change? How can you prove anything?
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 166
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quote: But what if they're really seeing reality and we're not? What if there is no color to it?
This is a lame example, but what about the Matrix? The human mind believes what it wants to believe.
My point was that reality doesn't change. It doesn't matter if there is color or not the point is that whatever is actually true is true we just can't see it.
When God speaks, reason must be silent. - Martin Luther
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Registered: November 05, 2004
Posts: 6040
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I like this theory. It makes the universe seem, on the whole, a lot nicer. I suppose we'll find out just what's up once we die.
The more you know, the less you don't know.
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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quote: Like a colorblind person, they don't see the color but it's still there.
But what if they're really seeing reality and we're not? What if there is no color to it? This is a lame example, but what about the Matrix? The human mind believes what it wants to believe.
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: May 23, 2005
Posts: 166
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quote: So this is kind of an old thread, but I didn't want to start a new one and have people yell at me. ... Though I'll probably get backlash for bumping this anyway. *shrugs*
I recently came to the same conclusion as you, Brehon. Don't we define reality by what our mind perceives? So then if we perceived and believed that in the afterlife, a certain thing happened, why wouldn't it happen? We define reality, so why not after-reality, the afterlife?
Our reality is defined by what our mind percieves, that doesn't change what reality is. Like a colorblind person, they don't see the color but it's still there. The reality didn't change it was the person who saw it. Reality itself doesn't change. We just don't see it all.
When God speaks, reason must be silent. - Martin Luther
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Registered: May 07, 2005
Posts: 62
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So this is kind of an old thread, but I didn't want to start a new one and have people yell at me. ... Though I'll probably get backlash for bumping this anyway. *shrugs* I recently came to the same conclusion as you, Brehon. Don't we define reality by what our mind perceives? So then if we perceived and believed that in the afterlife, a certain thing happened, why wouldn't it happen? We define reality, so why not after-reality, the afterlife?
To hold a grudge is like being stung to death by one bee.
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Registered: June 14, 2004
Posts: 2721
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Brehon, no one listened to me when I made a statement similar to yours. It was in a thread about how someone can be a good person and not believe in God but still go to hell...Here's what I said: quote: Just because I'm Christian and I believe in that religion does not meant that I'm right, you know? Another religion could be the actual true one. Or maybe they're all true and people who believe in Christianity will go to Heaven and people who are Buddhists will reach Nirvana, etc. I don't know. And that's just it---I don't know.
So I think that, if you're a Christian, then yes it's necessary to believe in God and have faith in God because that's where the religion stems from---faith. You still need to do the right thing and be a good person, but, if you're Christian, believe in God because the whole purpose of Christianity is that you have a God to believe in. Does that make sense?
But if you're not Christian, than being a good person will get you just as far in life. When you die, I think you'll still go to a heaven of some sort, though it probably won't be the Christian heaven (and I don't mean that the Christian heaven is better or worse---it's just there for those who do believe in God).
Also in the same thread: quote: That's not what I believe. It's just not. I can't believe and live in a world where good, righteous people will go to Hell simply because they believe in something different than I do. It's wrong and unfair and completely idiotic. If I had a close Muslim friend who I knew had everything good about her, I would not want to, nor would I believe that she was going to go to Hell when she died because she believed in Allah instead of God.
About after life: quote: I also think we create our own heaven...Meaning, when we die, we'll go to a place where, to us at least, everything is perfect. And there's no pain, no suffering, you're just at peace. Forever.
Anyways, those are some previous thoughts I had relating to this subject. You put it much better and more concisely than I did. It's cool that you're a Druid and I'm a Christian yet we basically believe the same thing about the after-life---whatever you believe will happen when you die, will happen.
Belief makes things real/Makes things feel, feel alright/Belief makes things true/Things like you, you and I
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Registered: November 22, 2004
Posts: 750
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Although we can't definitely say anything about the afterlife, we can probably say fairly that whatever happens happens to all people, whatever that happening may be. I find it hard to believe that we could simply choose our afterlife, then again I am a christian and I choose heaven if I am worthy enough to go there. As for those not knowing about God going to hell, the answer is that before christianity there was judaism as a path to heaven, and the bible also says that every man will have a chance at salvation before he is condemned to hell. How this works is beyond me, but I believe that God wouldn't just say "whoopsy, bad luck for you, hell for eternity" about people who aren't saved. What would he do about the mentally handicapped? I honestly think it is more likely that people would get a free ticket to heaven than to hell.
"Mac, you ever been in love?" - "No, I've been a bartender all my life."
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Registered: October 06, 2004
Posts: 3372
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quote: Originally posted by CelticNewAger:
No, papers with wishes are put into it now.
That is very cool, I did not know that.
O of where dost thou hail, Celephanil, Celephanil? Why dost thou wander in Tengelwar great, why on the sea do you sail?
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Registered: December 11, 2003
Posts: 9501
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No, papers with wishes are put into it now.
"Regardless, I have always, and will always, succeed."
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Registered: October 06, 2004
Posts: 3372
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ok, I was just thinking of the "wicker man"...ekk
O of where dost thou hail, Celephanil, Celephanil? Why dost thou wander in Tengelwar great, why on the sea do you sail?
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Registered: December 11, 2003
Posts: 9501
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Not anymore, no.
"Regardless, I have always, and will always, succeed."
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Registered: October 06, 2004
Posts: 3372
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quote: Originally posted by CelticNewAger:
A Druid on YN? Creepy, now I feel like my grandfather is on YN...
A druid? Don't they do human sacrifice?
O of where dost thou hail, Celephanil, Celephanil? Why dost thou wander in Tengelwar great, why on the sea do you sail?
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