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Registered: February 27, 2003
Posts: 2216
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quote: Originally posted by ampmaster:
just pretend there's a "wo" in front of the man
Nice save amp, nice save... I actually think that the Greek/Roman myths make more sense than most modern religions. If the gods are more human it explains why there are things like war, genocide, etc. They happen because the gods weren't paying attention or whatever. The gods aren't perfect so the world isn't perfect. Works for me... And, orange, I don't really get the whole "God's Octagon" vs "Satan's Octagon" thing, what's that about? And yeah, Triss and Maya, I think that is what she was saying, a sin is a sin no matter how "bad" it may seem to us. Which I don't get at all but, oh well.
"I know of no safe repository of the ultimate power of society but the people. And if we think them not enlightened enough, the remedy is not to take power from them, but to inform them by education." Thomas Jefferson
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by ampmaster:
just pretend there's a "wo" in front of the man
lol
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: February 22, 2004
Posts: 13926
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just pretend there's a "wo" in front of the man
"The very existence of flamethrowers proves that sometime, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done"."
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by ampmaster: quote: Like a silversmith leaves the impure metal in the fire until he can see his reflection in the end product, so does God with His children, lost and found.
DXR my man that is the best metaphor to explain that, that I have ever heard !I appluad you sir
erm... it's ma'am...lol i always get mistaken for a guy at first...;D thanks, amp 
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: February 22, 2004
Posts: 13926
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quote: Like a silversmith leaves the impure metal in the fire until he can see his reflection in the end product, so does God with His children, lost and found.
DXR my man that is the best metaphor to explain that, that I have ever heard !I appluad you sir
"The very existence of flamethrowers proves that sometime, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done"."
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by clpo13: quote: Hypocrites fight over God's name. The Crusades were a mistake. I'll fight for God, but not over His existence. That's silly. Discussion is so much more effective.
People fight because they feel their interpretation is the right one. But why doesn't God step in and put a stop to it instead of letting wars over his words (well, alleged words, to be fair) ruin lives? It's not a matter of whether these people are hypocritical; it's a matter of why God lets it happen, especially if he's as involved as you say. Heh, if I were to believe in any god(s), it would be the gods of the Greeks and Romans. They seem perfectly suited for the kind of messes this world gets into. The Greco-Roman gods were very human, and they'd have no qualms about pitting believers against other believers just for kicks.
That's party why I don't like the Greco-Roman gods. They're too human, too spiteful. A perfect god gives me something to strive for. As per the first paragraph: God lets it all go wrong because He's preparing us for something better. Like a silversmith leaves the impure metal in the fire until he can see his reflection in the end product, so does God with His children, lost and found. He's definitely involved. Just look at all these ministries in third-world countries. I mean, it's hard to see it in countries like the US or Britain or Canada, but it's all in the perspective. I see Him plain as day through nsung heroes I pass by on the street (ok, drive by). Others might jsut see them as pityfolk. X( so yeah.
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: November 05, 2004
Posts: 6008
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quote: Hypocrites fight over God's name. The Crusades were a mistake. I'll fight for God, but not over His existence. That's silly. Discussion is so much more effective.
People fight because they feel their interpretation is the right one. But why doesn't God step in and put a stop to it instead of letting wars over his words (well, alleged words, to be fair) ruin lives? It's not a matter of whether these people are hypocritical; it's a matter of why God lets it happen, especially if he's as involved as you say. Heh, if I were to believe in any god(s), it would be the gods of the Greeks and Romans. They seem perfectly suited for the kind of messes this world gets into. The Greco-Roman gods were very human, and they'd have no qualms about pitting believers against other believers just for kicks.
The more you know, the less you don't know.
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Registered: October 22, 2006
Posts: 2528
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quote: Originally posted by LoveTheRainbow: quote: Wow... you're the first person on YN that new what UFC was... <--- me happy
Lies. I knew what it was!-
You did?
J'irai bien.
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Registered: November 09, 2006
Posts: 144
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every body seems to be blaming God, when it is Satan's fault. I think Satan is doing hell of a very good job - well that is his job anyway, to make people feel that the world is God's Octagon. but the world is Satan's Octagon not God.
matt.13:16 But blesssed are your eyes for they see:and your ears, for they hear.
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by Maya: sorry for the double post but.... quote:
Lying is as bad as murder. Rape is as trivial as cheating on a test. Mutilation and racism are equal to "I want that necklace of hers SO BAD".
are you saying this literally? I'm sorry but cheating on a test...lying...jealousy? how can you even compare with the others?! I'm totally not getting the point I think :S and if in God's eyes they're the same is what you're saying...well...that's just fucked up...there's a difference between lying and ACTUALLY HARMING other people...
see Triss quote: Actually, I just said that 'cause I thought it sounded cool. I'm sure I'm leaning on some things (science, logic, reason all come to mind), but I meant it that way because I create my own belief system based on what I see and what seems logical to me. To me, a God like the one described in the New Testament (caring, compassionate, etc.) doesn't gel with what I see in the world, where so much senseless violence and meaningless death occurs. It just doesn't make sense, especially since the majority of the violence is caused by people arguing over God! I mean, come on. It would seem to the outside observer that the world is God's UFC. He's just sitting up there on his couch, eating Doritos, rooting for whoever's on top.
Okay, so maybe not, but that's the way it feels sometimes. I'm still undecided on the existence of God. I don't see him in the details like some do, but I'm not ready to completely dismiss him if I don't have the evidence necessary to do so.
It did sound cool. It sounded deep, is why i asked. My beliefs are based on what I've seen and felt in life. I can tell you that even though God is caring and compassionate, He is also just. The Old Testament says that, as does the book of Revelation. I love to read those riddle-ridden pages. No one seems to be able to understand them but me. :/ Hypocrites fight over God's name. The Crusades were a mistake. I'll fight for God, but not over His existence. That's silly. Discussion is so much more effective.  Uhm, the god you jsut described would be a deity, not God. The God of Christianity, as well as Judeism, is an involved God. Hey if God eats Doritos, I'll faint. I wonder, would that be why Doritos are so expensive? Because they're effectively ambrosia? XP 10 points to whoever knows that one!
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: October 28, 2005
Posts: 5354
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quote: Wow... you're the first person on YN that new what UFC was... <--- me happy
Lies. I knew what it was!-
draft beer not soldiers...
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Registered: October 22, 2006
Posts: 2528
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quote: . It would seem to the outside observer that the world is God's UFC.
Wow... you're the first person on YN that new what UFC was... <--- me happy
J'irai bien.
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Registered: November 05, 2004
Posts: 6008
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quote: What do you stand alone in? You'd be surprised how many would claim that and yet they are leanign on something.
Actually, I just said that 'cause I thought it sounded cool. I'm sure I'm leaning on some things (science, logic, reason all come to mind), but I meant it that way because I create my own belief system based on what I see and what seems logical to me. To me, a God like the one described in the New Testament (caring, compassionate, etc.) doesn't gel with what I see in the world, where so much senseless violence and meaningless death occurs. It just doesn't make sense, especially since the majority of the violence is caused by people arguing over God! I mean, come on. It would seem to the outside observer that the world is God's UFC. He's just sitting up there on his couch, eating Doritos, rooting for whoever's on top. Okay, so maybe not, but that's the way it feels sometimes. I'm still undecided on the existence of God. I don't see him in the details like some do, but I'm not ready to completely dismiss him if I don't have the evidence necessary to do so.
The more you know, the less you don't know.
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Registered: October 22, 2006
Posts: 2528
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Maya what I think she meant was that she believes that God judges all sins equally, no matter how big or how small and its only us humans, because we see the obvious concenquences to actions that are known as "sins", we make the conclution that sins that are more harmful to society are worst. Where as God doesn't care, a sin is a sin.
J'irai bien.
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Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1319
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sorry for the double post but.... quote:
Lying is as bad as murder. Rape is as trivial as cheating on a test. Mutilation and racism are equal to "I want that necklace of hers SO BAD".
are you saying this literally? I'm sorry but cheating on a test...lying...jealousy? how can you even compare with the others?! I'm totally not getting the point I think :S and if in God's eyes they're the same is what you're saying...well...that's just fucked up...there's a difference between lying and ACTUALLY HARMING other people...
Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
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Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1319
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quote: Originally posted by 272froggy:
hey, maya, if i were to agree with what you said, i should just kill you! see the error of your debate! oh, come on! sure let's kill everyone even though it is morraly wrong! me genoito!(greek for no) also God is a Just ?God that is why there is a hell, i hope you realize that christ is the only way to heaven, not by good works.
woah... seriously you should re-read my post, because you obviously didn't get anything
Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by clpo13:
You know what you're talking about, and I thank you for that. But I'm not that easy to convince. I've got a couple years worth of rather damning evidence to pit against religion, plus personal experience, having only recently left Christianity. Even so, I do my research, so I look forward to matching wits with you.
Oh, yeah, forgot, you seem to know a lot about religion as well. I'm impressed and reminded of my friend in Britain.
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: December 06, 2006
Posts: 71
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quote: Originally posted by clpo13: quote: If you coutn the Bible as a historical document, since it is accurate, there's one.
more evidence: Go read a book called "A Case for a Creator" by Lee Strobel. He's a former Atheist led to Christ by (Get this) SCIENCE. Evolution has been disproven for a century. There's no way we live today by chance. I advocate this book gladly. It's awesome! I learned a lot by reading it, and I think you would too, if you'd read it.
The Bible may be more or less historically accurate, but that doesn't not qualify it as evidence that God exists or that Christianity is the right religion. It offers no proof of either of those. Also, I have read some of Lee Strobel's books. They're not really that convincing. I have a hard time believing he was much of an atheist in the first place, considering some of the things that "convinced" him to become Christian. quote: My knowledge of what life is. We as humans are stupid, filthy, mean-spirited individuals. We have ugly thoughts and we jsut can't stand some people, and so treat them differently. I'll admit, I'm guilty. I lash back at those who annoy me. We try to meet the standards of mankind, but the standards of earth are always changing and are getting harder to fulfill.
I don't see how this is evidence. You're stating the rather obvious. That's no reason to believe in God, or whatever you're trying to prove. quote: Are you in the fray, or among the standing?
My answer? I stand alone. You know what you're talking about, and I thank you for that. But I'm not that easy to convince. I've got a couple years worth of rather damning evidence to pit against religion, plus personal experience, having only recently left Christianity. Even so, I do my research, so I look forward to matching wits with you.
(thanks, Trisscar) eheheh, erm, I was having a hard time concentrating bc I was at work when I posted that, so I'm sorry if it didn't make much sense. Well, you'd probably have a hard time believing I was once agnostic, but I was. I'm why-oriented. I like science. My issues with it are merely I can't keep my mouth shut. I see God in the obvious. It's hard to explain to a strong mind off the top of my head, but basically, with my personal issues (see chd abuse stuff) behind me, I've learned to view things a little differently than the average person. That's partly why I can say things and not care about the resulting reactions. What do you stand alone in? You'd be surprised how many would claim that and yet they are leanign on something.
The Lord shall neither leave you nor forsake you. We are who abandon our creator, never vice versa. Trials and terrors of the world upon a Christian are just trials, strengthening our faith or destroying it altogether. Make the choice. Stay strong or believe in the lies.
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Registered: November 05, 2004
Posts: 6008
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quote: If you coutn the Bible as a historical document, since it is accurate, there's one.
more evidence: Go read a book called "A Case for a Creator" by Lee Strobel. He's a former Atheist led to Christ by (Get this) SCIENCE. Evolution has been disproven for a century. There's no way we live today by chance. I advocate this book gladly. It's awesome! I learned a lot by reading it, and I think you would too, if you'd read it.
The Bible may be more or less historically accurate, but that doesn't not qualify it as evidence that God exists or that Christianity is the right religion. It offers no proof of either of those. Also, I have read some of Lee Strobel's books. They're not really that convincing. I have a hard time believing he was much of an atheist in the first place, considering some of the things that "convinced" him to become Christian. quote: My knowledge of what life is. We as humans are stupid, filthy, mean-spirited individuals. We have ugly thoughts and we jsut can't stand some people, and so treat them differently. I'll admit, I'm guilty. I lash back at those who annoy me. We try to meet the standards of mankind, but the standards of earth are always changing and are getting harder to fulfill.
I don't see how this is evidence. You're stating the rather obvious. That's no reason to believe in God, or whatever you're trying to prove. quote: Are you in the fray, or among the standing?
My answer? I stand alone. You know what you're talking about, and I thank you for that. But I'm not that easy to convince. I've got a couple years worth of rather damning evidence to pit against religion, plus personal experience, having only recently left Christianity. Even so, I do my research, so I look forward to matching wits with you.
The more you know, the less you don't know.
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Registered: October 22, 2006
Posts: 2528
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