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Originally posted by EarthGoddess:

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You feel different when you have accepted Jesus.

I don't.

Well then, maybe you really haven't taken the whole Christian thing to heart; maybe you aren't at a point in your life right now where you want to feel Him in your life? If you really believe in Jesus, you WILL feel something when you accept him, maybe not a blow-the-earth-up kind of feeling, but something definetly changes. I'm sorry that you don't feel that, but obviously, you really haven't TRIED to feel it.

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You feel different when you have accepted Jesus.

I don't.

Okay. Here's the Difference!

You feel different when you have accepted Jesus. It's just something you have to do to understand it. When you pray, you can tell that He is there because you can just feel His presence. Also, things happen that wouldn't normally happen when you pray! If you pray for comfort, you instantly feel comfort. If you're scared, you feel better. But you really have to believe that he can help you if its gonna work! Cuz if u dont believe, then why'd u pray in the first place? But anyways...it's just something you can tell is there...

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I understand now, you belive that it is possible that there many ways to God. I assumed before that you didn't belive that because of the words of Jesus:

"no one comes to the Father but through Me" (John 14:6)

No.

That is not what I mean.

If you are a Christian, the only way to Heaven is to believe that Jesus was the Messiah and to believe in God and ask for His forgiveness.

If you are a Jew, the only way to Heaven is to believe in God and ask for his forgiveness.

If you are Buddhist, the only way to reach Nirvana is to follow whatever your religion teaches.

If you are a Muslim, the only way to reach the Islamic happy place is to follow whatever your religion teaches.

ETC. ETC. ETC.

Do you see how this is possible while still being a Christian and believing in God?

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Originally posted by redrepublican:
I had a pretty interesting debate on somnthing similar to this in my school

I go to a private school, a christian school. My Bible teacher is Baptist and my German teacher is a big Lutheran. I would go back and forht between the to guys and they would both tell me the opposite of what the other would tell me.
When it came to the question of what would happen to a person who never heard of Christ and died, my Lutheran teacher said this in a roundabout way:

We all desrve to go to Hell because we are all born with original sin. That is what would be fair. But God chose to offer Heaven to those who would believe. Believe. What is believeing? You dont believe. You dont do a darn thing to get Salvation. You dont have faith and you dont believe. GOD CHOSE TO SAVE YOU. HE CHOSE YOU.

He is of course speaking of pre-destination. If there is an issue riles up Christians into a heated debate, it is pre-destination.
For those who are ignorant, pre-destination is the belief that since God is all-knowing, He knows who will choose him and who wouldnt. So basically he "hand-picks" trhose he wants to save.

Personally this issue has shot my brain. I dont know what to think. It doesnt seem right to me that God would allow some to go to Heaven and others not. But then again who am I to criticize God? I dont know I have been struggling with pre-destination for years now.

What do yo guys think about pre-destination?

I believe that God already knows who will choose to follow her or not; however, I don't believe that God decides to prevent some from being saved. God doesn't predestine; he just knows what choices we are going to make with our free will.

Actually Bastrop, that's the word of John...

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Originally posted by WorthWaitingFor:
I don't think you really understand what I'm saying so I'm not going to go out of my way to explain it until you ask better questions.

I understand now, you belive that it is possible that there many ways to God. I assumed before that you didn't belive that because of the words of Jesus:

"no one comes to the Father but through Me" (John 14:6)

God is a myth. Case closed.

Sorry to break it to you, but mythology has nothing to do with belief in many gods.

Look it up.

Mythology is a body of myths belonging to a people addressing their origin, history, deities, ancestors, and heroes.

So your argument has no validity, zeeta's question still stands.

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Originally posted by zeeta2009:
Frst of allI mean who's to say that in a few thousand years people won't call "God" mythology?!

well first of all they wouldnt call God the mythology, thats te belief in many gods, its monothiesm.as in one God.

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Originally posted by BastropChapplin:
He's sinned because everyone (but God) has sinned, and the sin is still with him because hasn't taken his sin to Christ to get it forgiven.

Now I don't know a lot about Islam but if they have sin (I think they do) I bet your bottom, he's asked Allah for his forgiveness.

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what other afterlife is there besides heaven and hell?

Whatever afterlife Islam teaches. Like I said, I'm not down with the Islamic lingo.

I don't think you really understand what I'm saying so I'm not going to go out of my way to explain it until you ask better questions.

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the only way to God is through Jesus.

I'm sorry if you find this offensive, but I think that statement is complete bullsh*t. Why must all religions claim theirs is the only true way to salvation? Do you have any proof to back up your claim that Christianity is more the way to salvation than Islam or Judaism are?

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Originally posted by NickJ:
Is this to all faith in general, or just to the christian sense of faith? (sorry if it seems like i'm hounding you with questions... i'm just trying to get some insight...) and by acts, what do you mean? (like good community service type of acts, converting people acts?? I'm confused...)

the acts and the works that I am talking about are works of obiedience to God. you may claim to have faith or be loyal to God, but if you do not follow his commandments, then you are not really faithful.

Yes I am talking about the Christian sense of faith, because the only way to God is through Jesus.

I love answering you questions, I only hope I answered you questions.

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I am saing that if you claim to be faithful or have loyalty to God, yet that faith is not acted upon, then it isn't really faith.

Is this to all faith in general, or just to the christian sense of faith? (sorry if it seems like i'm hounding you with questions... i'm just trying to get some insight...) and by acts, what do you mean? (like good community service type of acts, converting people acts?? I'm confused...)

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Originally posted by NickJ:
So, what are you saying? Are you saying that people can only get to heaven by believing in jesus and then by doing works? And what works are you referring to? (the kind I am talking about? or like, 'saving' other people?)...

I am saing that if you claim to be faithful or have loyalty to God, yet that faith is not acted upon, then it isn't really faith.

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Many Christians are horrible people and I would say that they aren't really Christians but faux-Christians.

Or as I like to say, they're Christians, but they're not Christian.

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This is why I think the Christian god is an a-hole.

How can you think he is an a-hole if you don't think he exists... if you really don't believe in my God than you should consider me an a-hole or my religion... But how can you justify attacking the non existent?

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This is not what Christianity belives. Faith without works is not faith at all.

So, what are you saying? Are you saying that people can only get to heaven by believing in jesus and then by doing works? And what works are you referring to? (the kind I am talking about? or like, 'saving' other people?)...

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Originally posted by WorthWaitingFor:
I'm not denying that Mr. Muslim has sinned. I am denying that he has sinned simply because he belongs to a different religion and has never heard of Christianity.

He's sinned because everyone (but God) has sinned, and the sin is still with him because hasn't taken his sin to Christ to get it forgiven.

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I didn't say Mr. Muslim was going to hit his happy place with good works and nothing else. I said he is a good Muslim and believes wholeheartedly in Allah.Similarily, Mr. Christian would have to not only do good works but also believe wholeheartedly in God to reach heaven. I never said Mr. Muslim was going to heaven but that, by following Islam, he would have the good afterlife that Islam would provide.

what other afterlife is there besides heaven and hell?

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Originally posted by NickJ:
the lazy will believe that all it takes is a simple belief.

This is not what Christianity belives. Faith without works is not faith at all.

for it is written in the bible:
"What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is without clothing and in need of daily food, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and be filled," and yet you do not give them what is necessary for their body, what use is that? Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself." (James 2:14-17)

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Originally posted by BastropChapplin:
Because no one is perfect. Mr.Muslium has sinned, as every one has, and no ammount of good works will change that. We cannot win heaven with good works, or good behavior. You seem to have forgotton that. One must recive forgiveness in order to be
"perfect, as [God] is perfect." (Matthew 5:43)
and able to set foot in heaven. Our salvation is dependant on God, we have no power to save ourselves.

I'm not denying that Mr. Muslim has sinned. I am denying that he has sinned simply because he belongs to a different religion and has never heard of Christianity.

I didn't say Mr. Muslim was going to hit his happy place with good works and nothing else. I said he is a good Muslim and believes wholeheartedly in Allah. Similarily, Mr. Christian would have to not only do good works but also believe wholeheartedly in God to reach heaven. I never said Mr. Muslim was going to heaven but that, by following Islam, he would have the good afterlife that Islam would provide.

You might want to read my posts more clearly before assuming I don't know what I'm talking about.

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You know, for some time now, I have made a theory. That theory is that a person's religion (faith, dogma, beliefs, etc.) is going to correspond to what makes them feel most comfortable in life. The volunteer will believe that good deeds/works will be what counts; the lazy will believe that all it takes is a simple belief.

I think I've explained this to you before but I want to repeat myself for those that I haven't explained it to.

Here is the deal with the "Faith not Works" lesson. This is even for BastropChapplin.

Instead of saying that works don't matter and only your belief in God does, it should be said that, when you believe in God, the works will follow. That is how the lesson should be taught. If you do good things to help people but you only do it to look good in front of your peers or God or on a college app then it's not pure. It won't get you into Heaven. The only thing that will get you into Heaven is God. But once you accept God and believe in Him, those good deeds and helping others will follow because doing things like that is a basic value of Christianity.

So the lesson is, believe in God, follow Him and His Word and the good works will follow and you will get into Heaven.

Now, as many of you know, this doesn't always happen. Many Christians are horrible people and I would say that they aren't really Christians but faux-Christians.