It's a very convincing point and argument, but I still don't see why a kind God would even let all these things happen. Honestly, think about everything wrong that has happened and tell me that it was "in the plan" to occur.

quote:

Originally posted by finn620:
Only, there is a difference between skateboarding and mass genocides.

And there's a difference between a father and God. The extremity is the same.

Only, there is a difference between skateboarding and mass genocides.

quote:

Originally posted by Greenleaf771:
This God is a cruel God. If he has a plan, I'd like to know why so many people are dying. Why people can't tolerate each other. Why some people are stricken with crippling diseases, mental and physical. I just want to know why. If all these things were in the Christian God's plan, then I am glad I take little stock in it.

Green, I'm currently reading Angels and Demons by Dan Brown and a Lieutenant asks the carmerlengo this very same question. I'm going to use that passage because he explains it better than I ever could.

Chartrand took a deep breath. "I don't understand this omnipotent-benevolent thing."

The carmerlengo smiled. "You've been reading Scripture."

"I try."

"You are confused because the Bible describes God as an omnipotent and benevolent deity."

"Exactly"

"Omnipotent-benevolent simply means that God is all-powerful and well meaning."

"I understand the concept. It's just...there seems to be a contradiction."

"Yes. The contradiction is pain. Man's starvation, war, sickness..."

"Exactly!" Chartrand knew the carmerlengo would understand. "Terrible things happen in this world. Human tragedy seems like proof that God could not possibly be both all-powerful and well-meaning. If He loves us and has the power to change our situation, He would prevent our pain, wouldn't He?'

The carmerlengo frowned. "Would He?"

Chartrand felt uneasy. Had he overstepped his bounds? Was this one of those religious questions you just didn't ask? "Well...if God loves us, and He can protect us, He would have to. It seems He is either omnipotent and uncaring, or benevolent and powerless to help."

"Do you have children, Lieutenant?"

Chartrand flushed. "No signore."

"Imagine you had an eight-year-old son...would you love him?"

"Of course."

"Would you do everything in your power to prevent pain in his life?"

"Of course."

"Would you let him skateboard?"

Chartrand did a double take. The carmerlengo always seemed oddly "in touch" for a clergyman. "Yeah, I guess," Chartrand said. "Sure, I'd let him skateboard, but I'd tell him to be careful."

"So as this child's father, you would give him some basic, good advice and then let him go off and make his own mistakes?"

"I wouldn't run behind him and mollycoddle him if that's what you mean>"

"But what if he fell and skinned his knee?"

"He would learn to be more careful."

The carmerlengo smiled. "So although you have the power to interfere and prevent your child's pain, you would choose to show your love by letting him learn his own lessons?"

"Of course. Pain is part of growing up. It's how we learn."

The carmerlengo nodded. "Exactly."

idk know i jus believe in him no reason to doubt him.......i love jesus



r.i.p
sammy n jacob
we miss ya'll

latinos stand up!

quote:

Originally posted by Greenleaf771:
If he has a plan, I'd like to know why so many people are dying. Why people can't tolerate each other. Why some people are stricken with crippling diseases, mental and physical. I just want to know why. If all these things were in the Christian God's plan, then I am glad I take little stock in it.

Those are really good questions.
I've had a growing interesting in the books written by an author named Lee Strobel. He comes from an atheist background and has a very interesting life story.
In one of his books, "The Case for Faith" he investigates these very questions.
Check it out if ya like.

To answer the title of the thread. You don't. No matter what anybody says, you simply do not know that God is for real.

Nice. That's why no one should be given the position of God. The End.

Yes, only the peg men are alive and make a bloody mess when you destroy them.

Hey, sometimes that's fun. So I guess I'm cruel, too.

Agreed. It's like making a little lego village an then knocking everything down and beating the little peg men against the floor.

This God is a cruel God. If he has a plan, I'd like to know why so many people are dying. Why people can't tolerate each other. Why some people are stricken with crippling diseases, mental and physical. I just want to know why. If all these things were in the Christian God's plan, then I am glad I take little stock in it.

quote:

Originally posted by finn620:
I've never understood the "plan" thing. If I build a contained ecosystem and put various life forms in it, and then stare at them through the glass while observing the growth and change of the ecosystem over time, this constitutes a plan. I feel that the idea of a creator is similar, but building a universe for the purposes of scientific research seems a bit overkill.

So, does anyone have an idea as to what the "plan" may be?

Boredom? Lol, I mean come on. You're the omnipotent, all-powerful creator...ya gotta do something with that.

I've never understood the "plan" thing. If I build a contained ecosystem and put various life forms in it, and then stare at them through the glass while observing the growth and change of the ecosystem over time, this constitutes a plan. I feel that the idea of a creator is similar, but building a universe for the purposes of scientific research seems a bit overkill.

So, does anyone have an idea as to what the "plan" may be?

quote:

Originally posted by clpo13:
I tried asking already. Many times. Nothing happened. Nothing. And I believed, too. I really wanted to believe. But when I don't get an answer, when I don't have a return on my question, I'm not going to hang around waiting for one. I'd rather find an answer than believe in imaginary friends.

clpo, here's my only answer for this: Either God answered in a way that you didn't see or couldn't see or haven't seen yet...or whatever you asked wasn't in His plan.

I know that God is real because I can feel Him in everything I do. I have recieved a definite experience of salvation, and I know in my heart that God is real. I just look around at the things He has given me, and know that I have been truly blessed with the faith that I have. My God is real.

I tried asking already. Many times. Nothing happened. Nothing. And I believed, too. I really wanted to believe. But when I don't get an answer, when I don't have a return on my question, I'm not going to hang around waiting for one. I'd rather find an answer than believe in imaginary friends.

How do I know God is real?
I know him. It's one thing to know or understand an idea, its another thing to have a friendship. I think some people think of God as an idea or perhaps an uninterested deity, but I have gotten to know him as a friend (and a quite trustworthy one).
Some people ask me, "When you pray, does God answer?"
Yes. Not always with words, and he doesn't pour out long answers (at least to me he hasn't).
"If you seek me, you will find me, when you seek me with all your heart." ~God
I really think God talks to us a lot more than we think. I think we just don't listen.
If you want, ask him to show himself to you. Even ask out loud if it makes ya feel better. Ask him to show himself to you... and then keep your eyes and heart open
I don't know all the science behind how God talks to us and what not, but I am living evidence that you can be sure about his existence

But if you were God and never revealed yourself to someone, and that person said that they knew you existed and you knew that they weren't all-knowing and must have been basing their beliefs on the God that they had heard about from society, how would that make you feel?

Foolishness is in the eye of the beholder, and if that beholder is God, then to say you know He exists is no longer foolishness.