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But it was still to Nietzchean for a liberal. That was more Nietzchean than Reactionary.

I have my moments.

Sorry, I have the flu and in my hazy figments of reality I must have confused you with Horsey. I apologize to you, my ally in defeating the PeTA kooks.

But it was still to Nietzchean for a liberal. That was more Nietzchean than Reactionary.

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an animal rights kook

I'm an animal rights kook? Wow, first I'm a lesbian, now I'm an animal rights activist. I'm learning new stuff about me everyday.

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I deem this statment 100% true, because I say so. Therefore it is irrefutable.

A little Nietzchean for an animal rights kook don't you think?

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Originally posted by zzyzx:
A Defense of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America, 1787–88:
“The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. … It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service [the U.S. government] had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses. …Thirteen governments [of the original states] thus founded on the natural authority of the people alone, without a pretence of miracle or mystery… are a great point gained in favor of the rights of mankind”

So if Bush ever says God talked to him...well he's gotta go.

http://boards.youthnoise.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/215...10900073#39510900073

Uh-oh.....

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Too bad Ahnold vetoed it.

Too bad Connecticut is recognizing civil unions now. Arnold can bite me.

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Another groundless claim with no proof to back it up.

Here's proof: There is no God. (I deem this statment 100% true, because I say so. Therefore it is irrefutable.)

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an incredible lack of morality

No one cares. Americans are free from religious rule. That's the reason America was founded.

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The majority of Americans are Christian, making it a Christian nation.

First Amendment.

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Let the people vote! Hold a referendum and let the people decide once and for all.

That should happen in a couple years. (Based on a nationwide opinion poll) In 1996, the percentage of people who wanted gay marriage was 27%. In 2004, it was 42%. And the percentage of people who wanted civil unions in 2004, is 49%. As teens of today, the most liberal and non-discriminating group, get old enough to vote, gay marriage will most likely be legal in a decade.

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The only thing necessary in Christianity is faith. Not acts are needed.

What a dumb thing to say. You're making Jesus cry. Kindness and love are the only acts he asks for.

And like I've said a millions of times before, just because the majority of America is Christian, doesn't mean it's a Christian Nation. The majority of Christians don't even share your radical beliefs. You are a minority amongst the majority. And since this is a Republic, you're not getting a Theocracy. Ever.

One more thing, if you going to follow one part of the bible that says gay people are bad follow all of it.

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1 Timothy 2

2:9 In like manner also, that women adorn themselves in modest apparel, with shamefacedness and sobriety; not with broided hair, or gold, or pearls, or costly array;

2:11 Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection.

2:12 But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence.

Damn those women, teaching, talking and wearing expensive clothes and whatnot.

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Probably somewhere between America having the largest religious population ratio for a secular country.

Not only does that not make any gramatical sense, but it shows that, though we were such a "devout" nation, we were still one of the mostr behind in creating reforms to get rid of slavery, stop child labor, help the general working conditions, or grant women the ballot. Some morals.

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Fundamentalist Evangelical Christians, as a whole, make up a small percentage of the population, yet you seem to see them as the cause of society's ills. You would have fit in well in 1930s Germany.

well, the Religious Right elected our all-knowing president, and Representitives, and Congress. So yes, I see them as the cause for society's ills because they are.

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Haha, yes for as sure as I am typing this, the Evangelicals are declaring the pledge unconstitutional, taking down the ten Commandments, taking God out of the schools, allowing abortion, and okaying gay marriage.

hm. Wow, lets inject some foolish sarcasm into the talk. That makes you seem very intelligent.

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You're proving my point. The latter 9 commandments are guidelines for living a Christian life. Belief is the only thing necessary in Christianity for salvation.

that's because catholicism has been tainted. Catholics are pushed in ernest to do good works. The rest is a perversion of an ernest and respectable Roman-Catholic canon. One of the reasons they are the Christian faith upon which I cast the mildest eye.

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Culture determines a nation. Immigration dilutes culture.

...but our culture was created by immigration. Culture is not static, it's fluid. Darwin forbid things change.

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Originally posted by reactionary05:

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Could that be because who we are and not what we worship make us good people?

This is the one thing that seperates Christianity from the other mainstream religions, and why I find it so appealing. Take Islam for an example. If islam is true, we will all be judged not only on our belief in Allah, but also for our acts, our keeping of the five pillars. Not so in Christianity. The only thing necessary in Christianity is faith. Not acts are needed.

Didn't you just contradict yourself? You say that only faith is needed. By definition faith is something that cannot be rationalised as it cannot be proven. But then you say that, 'one of the reasons I believe in christianity is...' So you choose to believe in a religion because of how easy it is to get into heaven?

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A very solid point, but I do have a question. I looked up Unitarian on dictionary.com and got 3 definitions. The first was no help, but #2 was 'A monotheist who is not a Christian.' #3 was 'A Christian who is not a Trinitarian.' I hope you can understand my confusion, as the two definitions seem contridictory...

The same way you can have a theist who is a Christian and a theist who isn't one. A Unitarian can be either. It's just a name. You have Unitarians, and then you have Unitarian Christians. Ever heard of denominations?

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The pledge of alleigence certifies as a religious nation. The government practice of placing a hand on the Bible certifies us as a Christian nation. The majority of Americans are Christian, making it a Christian nation. If the majority of Americans were muslims, we would be a muslim nation.

So you're completely disregarding the treaty (which holds as United States law) that specifically says that we're not? The majority of Americans are white. Does that make us a white nation? The majority of Americans are fat. Does that make us a fat nation? The majority of Americans are educated. Does that make us an educated nation? Heh, definitely no to that last one. A nation is not defined by one part of the whole, it is defined by all the parts of the whole.

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Actually, the pledge was written by a Baptist minister

And he was a national socialist to boot. How about them apples, reactionary?

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Yes, but it is a reflection of the government. You're not going to find many theocracies with irreligious people and not many atheist government with very devout populations.

And what's wrong with that again?

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Culture determines a nation. Immigration dilutes culture.

The only reason the United States has a unique culture today is because of immigrants. I should think that obvious to anyone who's ever had a history class.

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Probably somewhere between America having the largest religious population ratio for a secular country.

Look, why is it so hard for you to accept that a country can be secular while the population is religious? So long as the government is secular, the country is secular. And yes, even our government is secular.

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I agree, but it is beside the point. Perhaps I should not say the country itself. The government of the United States, the one laid down by the Founding Fathers, is an Aryan Christian nation. When either of those demographics change, the First Republic (our current government) will have fallen.

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the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion

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Originally posted by northstar316:
is that between slavery or the industrial revolution, or between the latter and the communist hysteria?

Probably somewhere between America having the largest religious population ratio for a secular country.

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thus why we need to get the evangelicals out of government.

Fundamentalist Evangelical Christians, as a whole, make up a small percentage of the population, yet you seem to see them as the cause of society's ills. You would have fit in well in 1930s Germany.

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has your imagionary friend ever saved your soul?

It only needs to be saved once, and now is not the time.

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that's fun

Haha, yes for as sure as I am typing this, the Evangelicals are declaring the pledge unconstitutional, taking down the ten Commandments, taking God out of the schools, allowing abortion, and okaying gay marriage.

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because "Thou shalt have no other gods before me" is not one of the ten comandments, and disbelief a "deadly sin."

You're proving my point. The latter 9 commandments are guidelines for living a Christian life. Belief is the only thing necessary in Christianity for salvation.

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so immigration dilutes the power of the nation?

Culture determines a nation. Immigration dilutes culture.

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I think you have misunderstood my point. America, for the better part of her existance, was a very moral nation.

is that between slavery or the industrial revolution, or between the latter and the communist hysteria?

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Says who? We've have a tyrannical government, huge trade deficits, an incredible lack of morality, and paralyzing foreign intanglements. Not the signs of an efficent government

thus why we need to get the evangelicals out of government.

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Another groundless claim with no proof to back it up.

has your imagionary friend ever saved your soul?

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Never said I support him, just pointing it out. And, adding to the point, his vp is an Aryan Christian, and his two opponents were Aryan Christians.

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We've have a tyrannical government, huge trade deficits, an incredible lack of morality, and paralyzing foreign intanglements. Not the signs of an efficent government

that's fun

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If islam is true, we will all be judged not only on our belief in Allah, but also for our acts, our keeping of the five pillars. Not so in Christianity. The only thing necessary in Christianity is faith. Not acts are needed.

because "Thou shalt have no other gods before me" is not one of the ten comandments, and disbelief a "deadly sin."

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The government of the United States, the one laid down by the Founding Fathers, is an Aryan Christian nation. When either of those demographics change, the First Republic (our current government) will have fallen.

so immigration dilutes the power of the nation?

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Originally posted by Euterpe:
Hence his embarrassing and nearly tragic approval ratings. Nearly 54% say they disapprove. Davis had 67 when they recalled him.

I've been saying this since I joined this site: Let the people vote! Hold a referendum and let the people decide once and for all.

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Well, for the first near hundred years, blacks couldn't run for President.

Yet there have been numerous negro presidental candidates recently, and none of them have made past even the democratic primaries.

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Not all our Presidents followed Christian religion. Read.

A very solid point, but I do have a question. I looked up Unitarian on dictionary.com and got 3 definitions. The first was no help, but #2 was 'A monotheist who is not a Christian.' #3 was 'A Christian who is not a Trinitarian.' I hope you can understand my confusion, as the two definitions seem contridictory...

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Lack of morality is not the government's job to mend.

Yes, but it is a reflection of the government. You're not going to find many theocracies with irreligious people and not many atheist government with very devout populations.

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It is the job of the people. And with this "largely Christian nation" you claim we are, shouldn't there be more morality?

I think you have misunderstood my point. America, for the better part of her existance, was a very moral nation. A shiny city on the hill. Today, she is not. Our nation is like those hollywood christians. They were crosses and claim to be religious, then they turn around and participate in very anti Christian activities.

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Could that be because who we are and not what we worship make us good people?

This is the one thing that seperates Christianity from the other mainstream religions, and why I find it so appealing. Take Islam for an example. If islam is true, we will all be judged not only on our belief in Allah, but also for our acts, our keeping of the five pillars. Not so in Christianity. The only thing necessary in Christianity is faith. Not acts are needed.

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Actually, the pledge was written by a Baptist minister, and did not include the word 'God.' He also wanted to put 'equality' in the pledge, but he knew they would never allow it because they, at the time, were against equality for women and blacks.

The pledge, has it appears today, would not appear in any country that was actively trying to be as secular as possible.

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With the 'under God' it certifies we HAVE religion, in any form, as opposed to 'godless communists.' And our right to refuse to say the pldege certifies us as a free nation.

Of course. America is a secular nation with Christian background.

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Which is something you can decline to do in a court of law.

But it is still the Bible, not the Koran, not the Torah, not Mao's Little Red Book.

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The majority of Americans speak English, is that our official language? No. In twenty or so, the majority of Americans will be of Hispanic decent and speak Spanish. Will that be our official language? No.

I agree, but it is beside the point. Perhaps I should not say the country itself. The government of the United States, the one laid down by the Founding Fathers, is an Aryan Christian nation. When either of those demographics change, the First Republic (our current government) will have fallen.

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No, we'd be the same nation, and we may swear on a Qu'ran instead of a Bible. And still, if you're Christian, Atheist, etc, you can hold up your right hand an affirm.

Once again, I may have used the wrong word in calling it a Christian nation. The First Republic (the current government) is a Christian government that does not acknowledge any certain state church.

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Originally posted by reactionary05:
Too bad Ahnold vetoed it.


B*tch.

Hence his embarrassing and nearly tragic approval ratings. Nearly 54% say they disapprove. Davis had 67 when they recalled him.Approval Ratings

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I don't like him any more than you do! I was simply pointing out that he is an Aryan Christian, just like every other leader we've ever had.

Well, for the first near hundred years, blacks couldn't run for President.

Not all our Presidents followed Christian religion. Read.

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Says who? We've have a tyrannical government, huge trade deficits, an incredible lack of morality, and paralyzing foreign intanglements. Not the signs of an efficent government.

Lack of morality is not the government's job to mend. It is the job of the people. And with this "largely Christian nation" you claim we are, shouldn't there be more morality?

Could that be because who we are and not what we worship make us good people?

But I guess that's madness. The other things I agree on you with.

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The pledge of alleigence certifies as a religious nation.

Actually, the pledge was written by a Baptist minister, and did not include the word 'God.' He also wanted to put 'equality' in the pledge, but he knew they would never allow it because they, at the time, were against equality for women and blacks.

With the 'under God' it certifies we HAVE religion, in any form, as opposed to 'godless communists.' And our right to refuse to say the pldege certifies us as a free nation.

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The government practice of placing a hand on the Bible certifies us as a Christian nation.

Which is something you can decline to do in a court of law.

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The majority of Americans are Christian, making it a Christian nation

The majority of Americans speak English, is that our official language? No. In twenty or so, the majority of Americans will be of Hispanic decent and speak Spanish. Will that be our official language? No.

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If the majority of Americans were muslims, we would be a muslim nation.

No, we'd be the same nation, and we may swear on a Qu'ran instead of a Bible. And still, if you're Christian, Atheist, etc, you can hold up your right hand an affirm.

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Originally posted by northstar316:
And the fact you said "aryan" is scaring me.

haha, White Pride World Wide, b*tches!

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The liberals are winning.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9161222/

B*tch.

Too bad Ahnold vetoed it.


B*tch.

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Isn't he failing miserably? Aren't the people of America slowly losing their faith in him?

Never said I support him, just pointing it out. And, adding to the point, his vp is an Aryan Christian, and his two opponents were Aryan Christians.

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Again, the hypocrisy.

Have I ever advocated violence against minorities?

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Neither can imaginary friends. Oh, snap!

Another groundless claim with no proof to back it up.

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Even the Republicans don't like him any more. A top person in the Bush administration (anonymous as of yet) even said that we're currently in post-Bush America...and the man's got three more years left!

I don't like him any more than you do! I was simply pointing out that he is an Aryan Christian, just like every other leader we've ever had.

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So do I. So stop it with the Christian America thing. Secular government works.

Says who? We've have a tyrannical government, huge trade deficits, an incredible lack of morality, and paralyzing foreign intanglements. Not the signs of an efficent government.

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You know, I still haven't seen anything out of you disputing my claim that America is non-religious. Can't stand to see a godless anarchist be right, eh?

The pledge of alleigence certifies as a religious nation. The government practice of placing a hand on the Bible certifies us as a Christian nation. The majority of Americans are Christian, making it a Christian nation. If the majority of Americans were muslims, we would be a muslim nation.

[QUOTE]

I don't believe in ID as you hear it described most, since I'm more deistic than most, but essentially I believe the universe was created (for lack of a better word) by some greater being, which then left the universe to its own devices. I don't believe in the eternal soul, I don't believe in any messiahs, and I sure don't believe there is such thing as a god who listens to prayers and passes judgement on people who couldn't give a crap either way (like me).

As I like to say, "I don't try to make you worship my imaginary friends."

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Neither can imaginary friends. Oh, snap!

buty I thought you believed in intelligent design. I am confused.