quote:

Chr-ns are going to mess up. It's human. We fall. I'm over it, how bout you?

i still have high hopes coz as much as im concerned i still believe and feel that God still wants us, human, to go back to His old ways, as what the early Christians did, that's why God was pleased with them. by the way,those Chr--ns who say they are of God, or rather they were taught to believe they are Chri--ns but do horrible things to man and in the sight of God are victims of their own ignorance. i believe that most of the people are looking for God, they just dont know how , or where to find Him. some "religious leaders" use only a several of Biblical verses then claim they are of God already, making people believe on what seem to be true. they thought being a Christian is as easy as swearing an oath. Remember what Jesus said: in Matt. 7:21 not every one that saith unto me, Lord,Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven: but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven . " on this verse, God has a qualification for someone to be able to enter into the kingdom. coz not all human who call on the name of God, will enter into the kingdom of God. if God mentions of entering into the kingdom of God, there must be a gate, a door, a way on how to enter.. and that's the straight gate or path.. as what is mentioned Luke 13:24.
i still believe that today, if people who will only follow the commandments of God, God will abide in them. God lives in them humans who follow his orders and commandments. in 1john 3:24 And he that keepeth His commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. and hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us. in this verse, God will sent a spirit to his servants, and that spirit of God will make us able to follow God's commandments. there are those say that God's commandments are impossible to follow, well to those people whom God has sent his spirit, it is not impossible, because it is the will of God that worketh in true Christians to do His will. (phil.2:13) - for it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do his good pleasure.
i got tired of man's immorality, so i searched for God why man is like this or that, or why life is like this and that.. and the light shoned. please try to read the Bible. it's not jst a book, but the words therein are of power. the words are not just merely words.. the word is God. in John 1:1 - in the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

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Gravity is absolute.
2+2=4, no matter how you spin it.
I'm female. I'm pretty sure that's absolute.

The idea of gravity falls apart at the quantum level. 2+2=4 depends on subjective definitions of how much 2 and 4 are. And the word "female" is just a word; it could mean anything.

I don't agree with speed that nothing is absolute, but there is quite a lot that is relative.

quote:

Originally posted by speed:
No we can't, but don't bitch about my spelling and then disregard your own like that, it doesn't look good, and as a whole, your arguments will have less value in the eyes of others, not because of their content, but because you make claims wich you don't later abide to.
Everyone here that has read anything by me knows my spelling is terribad , but I've made it clear enough that I'm not good at it for a reason, and that I don't really care about it being so, thus so far it seems to be accepted. Try to do the same.

Back on topic please.

Ask yourself why you're catholic, and try to come up with a well thought out answer. Then analize the diverse points that compose that answer and try to counterargument yourself and question them yet again. It's really an infinite process, so you only have to keep questioning yourself untill you feel that you've given ideas and concepts sufficient thought for them to be well defined.
Theological issues are all hypothetic, nothing is absolute. Remember that.

Ok, apparently my online joking skills have diminished from disuse. I was teasing! Making light! I know full well that a lot of people here can't type the best, and I wasn't attacking you, nor was I putting my own grammar mishap off!
Trust me. My friend from Singapore has horrendous spelling and grammar. We joke about it.
I apologize for the misunderstanding. I shall be sure to carefully word my jokes in the future.
--------btw I always abide by what I say. Hypocrisy is a crime I refuse to fall into again.

Nothing is absolute?
Are you absolutely sure?
Gravity is absolute.
2+2=4, no matter how you spin it.
I'm female. I'm pretty sure that's absolute.
The past is absolute. What's done is done, no matter what whoever remembers.

of course, I'm only trying to make people think more.
------
orangegoddess, I must disagree.
Chr-ns are going to mess up. It's human. We fall. I'm over it, how bout you? (odd thing: I'm a perfectionist lol)
The issue is when we fail to repent and ask God for forgiveness. If I lie and deny I lie, I've just lied doubly. That condemns me. If I admit I lie, but refuse to take responibility for it, then that, too, condemns me. Only when I ask God forgiveness and honestly try hard not to lie have I not been condemned, but absconded.

Also, the Christianity of today is much looser than it was back in Jesus' day. I mean, c'mon, I refuse to wear a skirt, for crying out loud. Even in the 20s and 30s (40s and 50s started off a little bit) for a woman to be caught in leggings was simply unheard of. Pants were for men. *raises hand* um, excuse me, I'd like to keep my comfy jeans, thank you.

Rock and roll. Everybody hated rocknroll when it first showed up. Now there are countless metal bands that proclaim the glory of Christ, and they're wholehearted, despite the cool hair and riches, which very often they donate and tithe.

The morality of today's Christian has also fallen. I'll admit it; I've made a lot of mistakes with boys in the last few months. I also blamed it on my ex (who was my ex at the time of the mistake... doubly condemned, arg! DX), which was foolish. I could have said no. I lost him anyway, didn't I? (yeah... I did... oh well. I'm getting over it. how bout you?) I'm also still trying to stop taking back what I've given God to handle. Again, I don't preach perfection, despite how I'm wired. I'll joke about it, (and it's quite obvious because I usually put oxymoronic or ironic things in at that point) but I won't preach it.

I see a lot of "haters hiding behind a cross" lately. They are the ones who preach Christian, go to church, and then turn around and go on a whorespree or something like that. Or worse, they preach perfection and claim to be better than others. That annoys the truly devout Christians just as much as it annoys non-Christians. At least, it should. I know it bugs the heck outta me.
-------
Peace

In a true and pure religion, the actions or fruits of the members will manifest if it is of God or not. The world is corrupt. Christians who do bad things are not Christians in God’s sense. They are only Christians by name but not by heart and mind. If Christ is the head of the church, he surely will be making his church pure. He will excommunicate the bad eggs. As the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind: which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels but cast the bad away. (Matt. 13:47) Christians sin too, but not the sin of the world as what the world is doing. Some sin willfully; others sin out of sudden reaction. Some sin feeling guilty and so ashamed that they don’t want to pray to God and ask for forgiveness anymore. Eventually go back to being a sinner. It is inevitable that there are bad people in a religious group, but if most of the members are “bad” then I don’t think it is Christ who is heading that group but a fake or false Christ.

No we can't, but don't bitch about my spelling and then disregard your own like that, it doesn't look good, and as a whole, your arguments will have less value in the eyes of others, not because of their content, but because you make claims wich you don't later abide to.
Everyone here that has read anything by me knows my spelling is terribad , but I've made it clear enough that I'm not good at it for a reason, and that I don't really care about it being so, thus so far it seems to be accepted. Try to do the same.

Back on topic please.

Ask yourself why you're catholic, and try to come up with a well thought out answer. Then analize the diverse points that compose that answer and try to counterargument yourself and question them yet again. It's really an infinite process, so you only have to keep questioning yourself untill you feel that you've given ideas and concepts sufficient thought for them to be well defined.
Theological issues are all hypothetic, nothing is absolute. Remember that.

quote:

Originally posted by LoveTheRainbow:

quote:

I am the grammar/spelling nazi. Sux for you,

I would like to point out that the "grammar/spelling nazi" used "Sux" instead of "Sucks"

lol I know, it's a horrible habit. But hey, we can't all be perfect right?

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I am the grammar/spelling nazi. Sux for you,

I would like to point out that the "grammar/spelling nazi" used "Sux" instead of "Sucks"

srry about the grammar. as most people on here know I'm an american citizen living abroad. I've studied in spanish, thus my english spelling is horrid.

quote:

Originally posted by clpo13:
You've pretty much hit it on the button: I want to know, but I can't, so it pisses me off.

I guess I'd settle for people to admit they don't know so I don't have to deal with religious superiority complexes, but oh well.

That's not a commentary on you, DXR, so don't take it personally. You don't seem like the type who'd refuse to listen to other ideas.

It's ok, I got what you meant
I make it a point to be open-minded. Others' thoughts count, and the only time I don't listen is when they pertain to me directly, as in, "Jo I think youre shirt is fugly". Pint: I get what you mean.

Hmm. Religious superiority... That's a nifty phrase. I see that a lot in today's Chr-n. "I'm Christian so I'm better than you because I know I'm going to heaven ha ha you lose sucker" is what I hear too often. That is very annoying and somewhat condescending. Ok, reverse that. Urgh.. alas it's an interesting time we live in, no?

quote:

Originally posted by speed:
the fact that you question yourself on these issues implies that on some level you want or need to believe in something for whatever reason, this is in no way bad. Most people are in a similar situation, be it conscious or unconsciously.

More than deciding on a certain current of faith or nonbelief I think the more relevant issue is why you have faith in something in the first place. Being in atheist I believe faith arises from a personal psychological need that developes during childhood/education. Thus most children brought up in religious families will share the inherent faith of their parents due to the absortion process that takes place during growth, wich will igrain values and behaviour patterns of the parents in the child.
When children reach early to mid teens logical rationale takes over, and instead of obtaining behaviour patterns from the parents and the surroundings the individual starts to synthesize his own through what has been aquired so far. This can result in abandoning a certain belief due to it not seeming logical anymore(I think clpo must know what I mean).

My personal opinion is that instead of questioning what you should believe in, you should question why you believe it.

Good questions. Bad spelling. I am the grammar/spelling nazi. Sux for you, but I'll let live.

Point: logic has nothing to do with religion... unless you're me or have a mind like mine o.0 for alas I think too much on the why of things and not enough on the what.

the fact that you question yourself on these issues implies that on some level you want or need to believe in something for whatever reason, this is in no way bad. Most people are in a similar situation, be it conscious or unconsciously.

More than deciding on a certain current of faith or nonbelief I think the more relevant issue is why you have faith in something in the first place. Being in atheist I believe faith arises from a personal psychological need that developes during childhood/education. Thus most children brought up in religious families will share the inherent faith of their parents due to the absortion process that takes place during growth, wich will igrain values and behaviour patterns of the parents in the child.
When children reach early to mid teens logical rationale takes over, and instead of obtaining behaviour patterns from the parents and the surroundings the individual starts to synthesize his own through what has been aquired so far. This can result in abandoning a certain belief due to it not seeming logical anymore(I think clpo must know what I mean).

My personal opinion is that instead of questioning what you should believe in, you should question why you believe it.

You've pretty much hit it on the button: I want to know, but I can't, so it pisses me off.

I guess I'd settle for people to admit they don't know so I don't have to deal with religious superiority complexes, but oh well.

That's not a commentary on you, DXR, so don't take it personally. You don't seem like the type who'd refuse to listen to other ideas.

quote:

Originally posted by clpo13:

quote:

lol I'd freak out with the highlighted Bible, for sure.

To be perfectly honest, I probably would too, but I'd end up shrugging it off as a coincidence. I need something a little (read: a lot) less deniable.

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I'm just, you know, a girl in these times who is just as DXR as you are atheist. The whole God talks issue is more a small whisper in the silence, for me. I've never heard God talkin to me, though I think its happened while Mom was lecturing me

I wouldn't go so far as to call myself an atheist. I don't deny God's existence. I do indeed lean towards the idea that he isn't there, but since I don't have proof either way, I'm still sitting mostly on the fence. I tried being atheist once, but it didn't work out because I was taking God's non-existence as much on faith as you take his existence. So now I'm a fence-sitter. More or less completely undecided. But no worries, I just haven't come up with a suitable label for myself. Maybe agnostic, but I think that even that's going too far in assuming things without proof.

Hopefully that made sense. I'm really tired...

it made sense.

um, I was watching a Christian comedy show (Bananas) oncec, and the guy that night was making fun of agnostics PLEASE NOTE I AM ONLY QUOTING AND IF YOU ARE OFFENDED I AM IN NO WAY TO BE HELD RESPONSIBLE THANK YOU -JO and he said "and one of my best friends made it perfectly clear.. Here is what we know: we don't know."

the irony is what I enjoyed from that, coupled with the fact that, yea, I woo once fit into that mold... hmm. *ADD kicks in, and DXR goes to play pingpong*

ok I'm back.
This day has gone by so slowly... :/

TEchnically, you have come up with a lebel for yourself (fence-sitter) however clash it is with the personality I pick up from my short time here.

No worries on being tired. I am too, frankly. ;D

quote:

Originally posted by plaidskirtflirt:
I'm a Catholic. I've been in Catholic school my entire life. I say my prayers in school but its more mechanical than spiritual. I go to mass and I just don't get anything out of it. I pray on my own and go to retreats and those are the only times I feel that I'm strengthening my relationship with God. And then all the controversy with priests abusing children has made me question my religion even more. I don't know if I want to be part of a religion that covers up this type of heinous crime. I was sexually abused as a child, not by a priest. Perhaps thats why this has been affecting me so much. A priest from my parish was an offender as was the priest at my high school. Its frightening. I feel as though the church isn't doing anything to rectify their wrong doings though. Just last week they made a statement that pretty much said, we can't give money to victims of sexual abuse because then we wouldn't have money for poor people. I don't want to abandon the faith I've grown up with, though. I'm so confused and I'm just wondering if there is anyone else out there who is disturbed by what's going on or if anyone has any advice on how to let go of the Church's wrongdoings. I've also considered changing to a different Christian denomination but I don't even know where to start.
Any advice would be appreciated.

I really question them too, thanks!

quote:

lol I'd freak out with the highlighted Bible, for sure.

To be perfectly honest, I probably would too, but I'd end up shrugging it off as a coincidence. I need something a little (read: a lot) less deniable.

quote:

I'm just, you know, a girl in these times who is just as DXR as you are atheist. The whole God talks issue is more a small whisper in the silence, for me. I've never heard God talkin to me, though I think its happened while Mom was lecturing me

I wouldn't go so far as to call myself an atheist. I don't deny God's existence. I do indeed lean towards the idea that he isn't there, but since I don't have proof either way, I'm still sitting mostly on the fence. I tried being atheist once, but it didn't work out because I was taking God's non-existence as much on faith as you take his existence. So now I'm a fence-sitter. More or less completely undecided. But no worries, I just haven't come up with a suitable label for myself. Maybe agnostic, but I think that even that's going too far in assuming things without proof.

Hopefully that made sense. I'm really tired...

quote:

if you believe in the Bible, EG. You'd believe taht not all who say they are of Christ's are Chriostians. And you'd also believe that there are false Christs making people even worse. True followers of Christ's don't kill, and are not greedy. in a true religion, evil peorple are inevitable but later when they have disobeyed God's commandments, they are ex-communicated. Have the apostles killed anyone? Judas Iscariot betrayed Christ but whether he be Judas or not Christ has to fulfill what the prophets have prophecied about Chrit's crucifixion.

I know all of that. But what I'm saying is that the Buddhists you pointed out are bad Buddhists who aren't following their religious principles like they should. And the Christians I pointed out are bad Christians who aren't following their religious principles either. Get it?

Just as it is against the Christian religion to fight, lie, steal, kill etc. It is also against the religion of Buddhism. But people do it anyway, and it isn't right to blame the religion. When I hear about another gay guy being shot to death for being gay on the news, I don't get angry at Christianity. I get angry at the individual for soiling the name of Jesus Christ. That same way I would get angry at an individual who would soil the name of Buddha.

In case you haven't noticed, I am perfectly tolerant of all religions and beliefs. But I'm not ok with people who want respect, yet disrespect another faith. If you can't be tolerant or respectful of another religion, I won't be tolerant or respectful of yours.

quote:

Originally posted by orangegoddess021706:

quote:

Most of the Christians I know get into fights, lie, steal, cheat, and are pretty greedy. A lot of christians blow up abortion clinics with people in them. Or murder gay people. Am I saying Christianity condones this? No. But, these are Christians. Smile

if you believe in the Bible, EG. You'd believe taht not all who say they are of Christ's are Chriostians. And you'd also believe that there are false Christs making people even worse. True followers of Christ's don't kill, and are not greedy. in a true religion, evil peorple are inevitable but later when they have disobeyed God's commandments, they are ex-communicated. Have the apostles killed anyone? Judas Iscariot betrayed Christ but whether he be Judas or not Christ has to fulfill what the prophets have prophecied about Chrit's crucifixion.

you are rather smart.

quote:

Most of the Christians I know get into fights, lie, steal, cheat, and are pretty greedy. A lot of christians blow up abortion clinics with people in them. Or murder gay people. Am I saying Christianity condones this? No. But, these are Christians. Smile

if you believe in the Bible, EG. You'd believe taht not all who say they are of Christ's are Chriostians. And you'd also believe that there are false Christs making people even worse. True followers of Christ's don't kill, and are not greedy. in a true religion, evil peorple are inevitable but later when they have disobeyed God's commandments, they are ex-communicated. Have the apostles killed anyone? Judas Iscariot betrayed Christ but whether he be Judas or not Christ has to fulfill what the prophets have prophecied about Chrit's crucifixion.

quote:

Originally posted by clpo13:

quote:

What are you looking for in a religion, clpo? I can tell you enough about most of them to give you an idea.

It's not that I don't know about religions. I try to find out as much as I can. The ideal religion for me would be one in which I get the answers I seek. Straight answers, not ones wrapped in riddles or given to me in strange ways. When I ask God if he's really there, I don't want to find a Bible sitting on a park bench with the word "yes" highlighted (while that does seem like a rather obvious sign, I might still chalk it up to some little kid running amok with a highlighter). I want God to tell me directly. Is that really too much to ask? I mean, it's not as if that denies free will. I still have the choice to be Christian or not. Just because I know for sure God exists doesn't mean I have to accept Jesus was his one and only son who was sent to save me. I could still say "Oh, yeah, God exists. Cool. So what?"

It just seems rather convenient that I can't get any straight answers from religion. A religion that gives me solid answers (backed up with proof, of course) is one I'd follow. Maybe. I'm not big on religion anyways, so I don't know what would really happen, even if God popped up in my room right now. I might hit him over the head with a chair or something. It's not a good idea to startle me.

lol I'd freak out with the highlighted Bible, for sure.

The whole thing about a lot of the religions today, I find, is the fact that there aren't a whole lot of easy answers. I've tried to find easy answers in the Bible, and through prayer (when I remember to pray - forgetful little me), but it doesn't realy work out. I've had to see things through a filtered lens to see what God wants me to know. Even then, some questions just don't get answered until God says I'm ready. (Side note: I can be very impatient sometimes. lol) I hate it when He does that!

As for God saying "Hey, dude, I'm real," I think I'd have a heart attack if that happened. I'm no prophet! I'm just, you know, a girl in these times who is just as DXR as you are atheist. The whole God talks issue is more a small whisper in the silence, for me. I've never heard God talkin to me, though I think its happened while Mom was lecturing me......... <.<; heheh

I'm not big on religion either. The root of the word is Greek for "to bind" and I don' want to be bound by beliefs; rather, I want to be liberated by them! That's why I connect myse