you have a point... the US did support Bin Laden ... and the "soldiers" did become assasins....

twisted fire:

First of all, don't use the word 'gay' to describe the US. Obviously you haven't read the homophobia debate or u wouldn't be stupid enough to call the nation homosexual.

We never supported bin Laden either, thats a bunch of bull. Ok- maybe we did train him, maybe other terrorists too, but also many US SOLDIERS; but its not like we intentionly went out to find anti-American terrorists who'd be willing to learn our secrets.

hell no. of course it ain't if it were, i wouldn't
be able to say this:
i think the US is totally gay, as well as patriotism. everyone is saying how great we are and how terrible the terrorists are. most of it's bull$h!t. the terrrorists were wrong to fly planes into the twin towers, but it wasn't unprovoked, which is what all ya'll seem to think. the US actually SUPPORTED Bin Laden. the US taught him how to fight. and it's not just Bin Laden that we've taught. for example...the SOA(School Of the Americas). we have taught millions of "soldiers"(assasins, really) there. those "soldiers" have killed priests and other great religious leaders(OSCAR ROMARO comes to mind) and have raped women and killed thousands of innocent citizens. it got so bad that everyone started calling it the school of assasins and they changed the name to invalidate that nickname.

KNOWING ALL THIS INFORMATION, HOW CAN YOU STILL BE SO ****ING PATRIOTIC AND JINGOISTIC ABOUT THIS SITUATION?

if you have any dissagreements, email me at:
youarestupid@youareadork.com

i think you're right in a way......... so keep on talking....

This seems to be a very heated topic and I agree with some of you...and yet disagree with most of you. I'm not sure what I would have done if I was in that judge's position. I'm against war completely but I back up the president war on terrorism. People who commit h**** crimes like Bin Laden must be brought to justice. On the other hand, I do not like seeing innocent people being injured and killed just for this cause. Our world is very diverse and obviously people are bound to come along who have different opinions. But that's what this board if for, is it not? It's for teens to rant and rave and let anything off their chest. That's the whole point behind message boards. Whether you agree with the statement or not, we still have a right to voice any opinion we feel important. We are not here to change other's opinions or belittle them because of their opinion; we're here to try an educate others and try to persuade them to see our point. Don't judge people due to their comments or discrimmate them if they happen to agree with something you're against. It's how our world works. Our job is to try an educate people and help them to see that everyone is equal and deserves to be treated in a fair way with justice and consequences.

right on tell em....

Sorrie.... love your point tho.

you are right there are limitations to freedom of speech, but maybe the judge didnt put aside his personal feelings. a person shoudl be able to voice their opnion as long as it doesnt hurt anyone. know what i mean?
but as you said if you believe in something fight for it. and katie was fighting for it, sadly it didnt do much good. kids should get the freedom of speech just as adults do, what would teh judge have done if an admistrator wore a shirt like Katies? what would he have done if Katie wore a PRO-WAR shirt?...... she was voicing her opinion and that is not wrong... to be honest i give her props...... and i would have done the same thing......

I think the judge may have let personal feelings and prejudices enter into the decision. All Katie was doing was expressing an opinion, and while I don't really agree with it, I still think she should have a right to express it. Voltaire comes to mind: (rough quote)

quote:

---

I may not agree with what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it.

---

How true. I'm not pro-war at all, yet I wouldn't think of wearing a shirt that says my opinion in my heavily Republican-redneck school. I would get beaten down as soon as I got in the door. Perhaps the judge thought Katie would get herself in danger with her opinions. Opinions and the reactions to them, as shown on this site, are dangerous things.
And another thing: Please refrain from people-bashing. I've seen so many angry posts it is not even funny. I know I've done a couple myself and it seems hypocritical, but really. This site is about people being wise and helpful, not spouting venomous retorts over the Internet at each other.

Our freedoms ARE limited, the constitution IS not all black and white. There are exceptions to every rule, including our freedom of speech. We are not allowed to wear certain clothing that advertise drugs or alchohol, or have an obsessive amount of profanity, around school. We are not allowed to yell obscene remarks in public places. Are these limiting our freedom?? ABSOLUTLY! Does that mean we should be able to say what we want, when we want, to whomever we want?

Katie must have known that she was going to cause attention with her t-shirt. It was a distruption at school. I don't blame anyone for making her remove it. Does that mean everyone is supposed to be pro-war? I hope not, cuz I'm sure as heck that I didn't agree to that.

If you really believe in something, by all means fight for it. But make a point just to make a point. Really know what you're getting into, and do something that could realisticly acomplish your goal. Whether it be to alert others of the problem, or change it. Just remember Newton's law: Every action has an equal but opposite reaction.

~Sarah

Whats wrong with us voicing our opinion here? This is a message board after all, and its a common place for teens all over the world who want to be heard to come. I'm willing to bet a good amount of us "screw ball kids" are showing leadership skills back into our community. I for one a WI State Youth Leadership Council. We're not just some random kids venting, we're the future, and we have every right to be heard and play a part in building our world.

Screw your self Steven, i believe you are a 15 yr old yourself, unless you lied and came on as a different age. And if you could stop for a second and observe things or read you'd see that i did... you'd be singing a different tune when your freedom of speech is tooken away wouldnt you?

I used the terms "screwballs" and "screw up kids like you" to refer to screwy, conceded kids like you in my response! Who edited that? It's gone now!

hey erica thanks ...........do you have more news about her? i would like to get in touch with her but i dunno how. could you guys help me? thanks .......

hey that waz great..... we have the freedom of speech or at least what we think it is or whats left of it and use it.. dont let any one belittle what you think or say, contradicting ppl puts them in their place, right on girl
onelove

Yes we are contradicting the President, and that does not make us bad. Juss because he happens to be the President of America it does not mean that every little thing he says and thinks is right. Remember he is still human and so are we, which means we do think for ourselves. Just because we are kids it does not mean we do not have voices. Its people like who are ignorant enough to think that teens dont have their own minds and are smart enough to have their own voices. And yes I am 15, do u have a problem with that? Age doesn't matter its what you think that matters. Did you not know that already? I dont care if his speech was recognized by world leaders all around the world, it does not make all of it right. Juss because we are kids it doesn't mean that "powerfull' grown ups can take our rights away. Do u not get it? I love kids like me........ more kids need to stand up and speak out........ we are the future and we need to take care of our country starting today, and taking care of our country does not include violence in it...

Yes I am contradicting the president, got a problem with that? Is it so hard to believe that teenagers can have informed opinions from different viewpoints that are just as good as any political leader. Is there a problem that I see his "you're either with us or aganist us" speech as very narrowminded and cowardly in itself. To believe that there are only two options and to try to convince the American people of this, is discriminating aganist all who disagree. To have a different opinion is allowed in this country and to contradict even the highest people in the country is ok because everyone has the right to free speech. If people weren't copntradicted they would make up their own system suck people into it, gain power and rule whatever they wanted just because someone didn't say anything about why what the person said was wrong. So if you got a problem with my contradicting the president speak up because I don't see anything wrong with it.

Katie Sierra is definitely a NOISEmaker! In my opinion, her story sounds like another attempt to silence today's youth. You better believe its going to take more than a suspension to do that.

If the Va. courts read a couple of NOISEboard posts, they would see that young people all over the world have strong views and a powerful voice that refuses to be silenced.

Get the 411 on Katie!

How old are you guys? 15? 17? Do you guys realize what's going on when you made that comment about the president's statement of "You're either with us or against us.."? Are you contradicting him? Do you realize that you're just a kid whose questioning a the president? Look at all the people whose behind him, his advisors, national counsels. His speech was reconized by world leaders all over the world. Then people like you came along and think you have a right, you think you have a voice. You're full of it.

[This message was edited by YNLissa on November 12, 2001 at 12:08 PM.]

whatever dude........ dont be that way