Well then there you go, veggie. If your state allows you to drop out at a certain age, you can just do that, so you can quitchyerbitchin'.

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And I'm just curious, do high school drop-outs go to jail?

Depends on the state and the age that a person is allowed to drop out. I think most places it's sixteen-- earlier if you go to a school where they don't have funding and don't really care what you do.

That's another issue to debate, though.

Sorry veggiechick, but until you're 18 years old, The First Amendment does not apply to you. In high school, at home, or at the mall. Get over it. You're given rules and you follow them.

And I'm just curious, do high school drop-outs go to jail?

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Once again, school is mandatory; not going is illegal. You don't have a choice not to give up your rights. My school has a handbook, but don't have us sign anything.

Homeschool isn't illegal and you don't give up your rights. (Unless your homeschool teacher decides you do).

I'm assuming your in high school and under 18 or turned 18 after the beginning of your school year. Did your guardians sign any forms?

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your rights aren't stolen. You gave them up.

Once again, school is mandatory; not going is illegal. You don't have a choice not to give up your rights. My school has a handbook, but don't have us sign anything. I suspect your school is trying to trick kids into following the rules, saying,"Oh well you signed the paper!" Even if you didn't sign it you'd still be expected to follow the rules. You don't need to give consent, because you don't have a choice. Your rights are stolen.

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but in high school you don't sign away your rights, they're stolen from you when you walk in the door

WRONG! I know for my school we have a million papers to sign. One of them talks about random searches. My school officials have the right to search me at any time, for any or no reason because I GAVE them that right when I signed the paper at the start of the year. I also know that they had a section about dress code and part of that had to do with anything THEY deemed inappropriate. I signed that too. So unless your school doesn't have a hand book or a behavior license that you had to sign, your rights aren't stolen. You gave them up.

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I would like to point out that while at school you basically have no rights. YOU give them up in all that paper work you sign (but obviously don't read) at the begining of the year.

I don't know what level of school we're talking about here, but in high school you don't sign away your rights, they're stolen from you when you walk in the door. And if you decide not to surrender your rights by not going to school, then you go to jail for truancy. Just because school is mainly about learning doesn't mean students should lose their basic constitutional rights.

People who are arguing with me:

Here is a link http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Symbolic_speech. Click on it. Read it.

My wearing a band t-shirt does not require me to verbally express anything. Therefore, a band t-shirt would fall under the classification of "symbolic speech."

Symbolic speech is held to a lower standard than pure (or verbal) speech. Pure speech is held to strict scrutiny which means that the lawmakers must prove that the abridgment of rights furthers a compelling state interest. Symbolic speech is in a lower-tier of scrutiny, which means that it is up to those who feel their rights are being violated to prove that the law does not further a compelling interest.

I don't understand where there is room for argument. Those are the facts. If you don't like them, move to a different country or something...

I would like to point out that while at school you basically have no rights. YOU give them up in all that paper work you sign (but obviously don't read) at the begining of the year.

Well, without knowing exactly what was on the shirt, we won't know why it was banned. I'm betting, however, that it was a symbol I've often seen on HIM merchandise that looks a lot like a pentagram. In certain areas, that might as well be an obscenity.

But, as I said earlier, you don't have full rights in school. Needless to say (third time's a charm), school is primarily about learning.

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THE SUPREME COURT, WHOSE JOB IT IS TO INTERPRET THE CONSTITUTION (which is the source of our "freedom of speech") HAS DECLARED THAT NOT ALL "SPEECH" IS PROTECTED EQUALLY.

The Supreme Court says that freedom of speech does not protect obsenity. I was not refering to obsenity. I was saying that even non-political speech was covered, like a band shirt.

AND I CAN YELL TOO!

I don't think saying what band you like really counts as freedom of speech. I mean, I could say I like a band called Ultra Mega Nigger Sexy Baby-Killers or something uber-obscene like that, and while their name may be covered under the freedom of speech, that doesn't make it all right to wear a shirt about them, especially at school, which, as I said, is about learning, not sharing your musical preferences.

(I really, really apologize if anyone's horribly offended by that band name. Really.)

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Freedom of speech covers all speech, no matter how mundane.

THE SUPREME COURT, WHOSE JOB IT IS TO INTERPRET THE CONSTITUTION (which is the source of our "freedom of speech") HAS DECLARED THAT NOT ALL "SPEECH" IS PROTECTED EQUALLY.

Sorry about the caps lock...but no one listened when I spoke in a normal tone.

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Anyways, if you had been suspended for wearing a shirt advocating some sort of activism, then yes, your freedom of speech would have been violated. But a band shirt? Not even close.

Freedom of speech covers all speech, no matter how mundane.

It's the very nature of school that your freedoms are somewhat abridged. You go to school to learn. As such, it's natural that certain freedoms would be limited, especially in the case of clothing. For instance, clothing that advocates violence or illegal activities (such as a shirt with a marijuana leaf) are generally banned at schools for obvious reasons. Chances are, your shirt violated a rule like that. Perhaps the band's symbol looked too much like a pentagram for your principal's liking. I've no clue, since I know little about HIM or Hot Topic shirts (I once went into a Hot Topic and got funny looks from everyone in there; not a place I'd like to revisit).

Anyways, if you had been suspended for wearing a shirt advocating some sort of activism, then yes, your freedom of speech would have been violated. But a band shirt? Not even close. I can't find the words to explain the difference, but I know there is one.

While I'm not in favor of school uniforms, you have to realize that, as Ikki said earlier, you don't get your full freedoms until you're 18 and an adult. School is primarily for learning, not expressing what music you like to listen to.

I love how the majority of students who are like "omg I can't wear this top that would make a hooker blush or this t-shirt with a slogan that would make a fratboy shake his head and sigh and that totally violates my free speech" likely haven't even read the 1st Amendment or even know what the hell their talking about.

By the way a HIM t-shirt is about as close to artistic expression as taking a dump. The band playing music is artistic expression, wearing a t-shirt is expressing enjoyment of the band's artistic expression (here for known as "music")

Those points made I do find it highly entertaining that you school suspended someone for 5 days because of a t-shirt. Are you in an uber-christain area? or was the exact nature of this graphic risque enough to promote such a response?

In conclusion yes it is bull shit that you got suspended on a T-shirt but no your freedom of speech wasn't violated

The clothing you wear is not verbal speech. Therefore, it is not "pure" but "symbolic."

Pure speech is considered under "strict scrutiny," which means it is in the top tier of protection. If a law will violate something protected by the top tier, the burden is on the law maker to prove why the law is necessary.

Symbolic speech is in one of the lower two tiers of protection. At these levels it is necessary for the individual, who feels as though their rights are being violated, to prove that their civil liberties override the needs for which the law was created.

yea that is really dumb they deffinetly violate the whole freedom of speech thing, and as for the HIM shirt, my school has a pretty strict dress code, but they wouldnt suspend you for it, so i agree with it being a bunch of s**t

Don't you just love teenagers? They're so funny.

i totally agree with Ikki and would like to take it a step further. I am completely for school uniforms. plain and simple. and not just a "white polo shirt with black slacks" type, im talking everything is exactly the same. same shirt, shoes, pants from the exact same place worn the exact same way. then there wouldnt be such a problem of i cant wear an anti abortion"shirt or the school doesnt approve of my band shirt deal. and im sure it would eliminate alot of the bullying type groups that are in schools too. and like ikki said, your full rights arent granted until your 18, if you want to make a statement do that shit in college where you actually have to pay for your education and learn lifes real lessons