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Islam is a religion born of harsh times and environment

i'd actually say that Islam quickly reachd its zenith and was by no means developed in harsh times. Much of the European enlightenment was born from those with the Muslim faith. Unfortunatly the middle-east stagnated through 200 years of Ottoman decline and failed, unlike Turkey, to break free from colonial occupation following WW1 and develop into a democratic, secular and industrial part of the world.

Neph, I think the idea was this: what if our places were reversed? What if the West was primarily Muslim and the Middle East Christian?

Of course, it's only hypothetical, since it's doubtful Islam would have ever arisen in Europe and the Americas, considering how nature-oriented early religions were there. Islam is a religion born of harsh times and environment, which is why it's so seemingly harsh. The desert is not a place to be especially nice.

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That’s a dumb statement. If all the Arabs in the Middle East were Christian there would be no war on terror, and the inhabitance of the Middle East would not constantly be launching Jihads.

God, you are more stupid than I thought.

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do you seriously expect a website titled prophetofdoom to be taken seriously by anyone other than yourself?

It was the first okay website that I found. It is quoting directly from the Koran.

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who would probaly be right up with the arabs who are up in arms if they were christian and not muslim

That’s a dumb statement. If all the Arabs in the Middle East were Christian there would be no war on terror, and the inhabitance of the Middle East would not constantly be launching Jihads.

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Originally posted by speed:
Muhammad merely wrote a survival code which all tribes could abide to make their life easier.

Well, to an extent. Pork is banned for health reasons (as you said), and polligamy is allowed mainly for practical reasons. But as for alcohol, that's banned because it makes you act like an idiot and lose your self control, leading you to do more and more things that cause harm to yourself and those around you. And it's not fair to just state that women are discriminated against. As a woman in Islam, I have never once felt discriminated against. I think a lot of people look at head scarves and see opression, but I don't know, I look at fashion magazines and see opression, people trapped in their little boxes, judged completely on their appearance. Women and men are completely equal in Islam (the words "man" and "woman" are even mentioned the exact same number of times in the Quran. So is "day" and "night". And I think "month" is in there 12 times. It's pretty cool)

I do agree that Islam is a great guide to life, but I mean, I'm a Muslim. I think it's God's plan, so it should be the right one. And you can't disregard the spiritual aspects to the religion, if you read the Quran, most of the verses are concerning (either history or) thoughts and prayer.

I know it's late, but thanks for the post Dalecia.

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You're starting to look like a christian fundamentalist.

correction he is a right wing christian fundamentalist nut job who would probaly be right up with the arabs who are up in arms if they were christian and not muslim

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Here’s a website that has a collection of Islamic verses related to: war, Jihad, and other such topics
http://www.prophetofdoom.net/Islamic_Quotes.Islam
Also it’s not just a religion started in a mist of violence but its founder taught violence.

do you seriously expect a website titled prophetofdoom to be taken seriously by anyone other than yourself?
You're starting to look like a christian fundamentalist.

If I cared to, I could find just as many verses in the Bible advocating violence. True, most of those verses would be in the Old Testament and would more apply to Judaism, but do you think Judaism is a religion of violence?

Before accusing Muhammad of teaching wanton violence, you should investigate just whom he was advocating violence against. I believe you'll find that the only violence he condoned was that done in defense of Islam. Self-defense, in other words.

Here’s a website that has a collection of Islamic verses related to: war, Jihad, and other such topics
http://www.prophetofdoom.net/Islamic_Quotes.Islam
Also it’s not just a religion started in a mist of violence but its founder taught violence.

I have to say I agree to the extent that media and crazy extremists have darkened Islam's image in the eyes of the west, but I disagree on spiritual issues completely.

Muhammad merely wrote a survival code which all tribes could abide to make their life easier.

Why can't they drink alcohol? because in a desertic climate you become dehidrated even faster if you drink.
Why can't they eat pork? Because at the time of Muhammad's "predicament", there was a desease that affected pigs, which killed anyone that was infected with it.(I'll try to find the name of this disease, I can't remember it now)
Why is poligamy allowed? because in a hostile climate which difficults survival a large family unit has more chances than a small one.
Why are women discriminated? Because men's greater physical strength and endurance helped them survive much easier in the desert, creating the impression that women are weak.

A religion born of strife does not necessarily mean a religion of violence. There are very many portions of the Qu'ran that advocate peace. I would think a religion's holy book is more important than how it was created.

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You need to take it in context. Muhammad came from a tribal people who warred constantly with each other

I don’t completely agree with this argument, but let’s just say I do agree with it. Let’s assume that the violence was because of culture, does that show that Islam is not a violent religion? The claim is made that Islam is a religion of peace, but there is the undeniable presence of violence, and even if it was contextual as you say, doesn’t that point to Islam not being a religion of Peace?

You need to take it in context. Muhammad came from a tribal people who warred constantly with each other. You don't stop that by asking nicely. And even after he united the Arab tribes, he had to contend with Christian and Jewish groups out for his head. You can't lead your people when you're dead.

Muhammad was a reactionary. He didn't kill without a reason, and that reason was most often defense of Islam from overt and unwarranted attacks.

Christianity and Islam are two very different religions, and that is a direct result of the areas and eras in which they came about.

If you claim that Islam is a religion of peace then how do you explain the actions of its founder Muhammad? I have looked at Islam and I have a hard time believing that it is as peace centered as it is made out to be.

Great post. We don't seem to ever have very many Muslims on YN, so it's great that you're willing to show your religion for what it actually is and not what extremists make it look like.