Some of you say that a baby can't really "feel" until it's 6 weeks old or something. I'm not exactly sure, but the basic point you're trying to make is that it doesn't feel when it's first born. If you insist on this theory, then tell me, why does a baby cry when you drop it? Why would a new born cry when you dropped it? Hmmm... maybe because it hurt?
"I've heard this argument a lot in here: "if you don't want a baby, don't have sex!" Is there really a need to be so dramatic about it? Come on, we ALL know that there's such a thing as birth control, and less of us know that when properly used, condoms, the pill, and other methods can be totally effective. There's no need to not have sex."
Let me clear something up for you that you are obviously too blind (or ignorant) to see. Sexual intercourse produces offspring. Yes, it's true, sex makes babies. If you can not accept this fact, then you shouldn't have sex. For instance, I do support the use of birth control (the pills, condoms, spermicide, etc...), but what happens if it fails? In this case, the woman will get pregnant. If you want to have sex, you have to be prepared for any consequences. If not, then you are simply making a stupid mistake. Sex, in it's very basic form is only used for the creation of offspring. However, it has become perverted to be used as an act of pleasure.
Now don't get me wrong. I am not opposed to safe sex, but I am opposed to abortion, in these cases. Basically, the mother and/or father did not think things through before they decided to have sex. When doing anything you have to know the risks involved. The only way to prevent pregnancy is to not have sex. It's that simple. So, if you don't want to get pregnant, then don't have sex. However, if you want to do it for pleasure, than you should be aware and accept any consequences (pregnancy or STDs) involved. Anything less is incredibly ridiculous and to not take responsibility for your actions is merely contributing to the growing problem of apathy in our society.
Winddancer: I'd like to clear things up. Half of those quotes that labeled as mine are not. Some of those belong to deathbloomsforever, as I outlined. However you failed to make that distinction and would like to clear that up. Furthermore, you merely give examples, but not a reason. From your argument, one could easily believe that you think that foster care leads to abuse, neglect and death. I would argue quite the contrary. There are many positive things that come out of adoption. If you would like a specific example, my parents adopted my youngest brother from Ukraine, giving him a much better life than he would have ever recieved. So how can you judge what an unborn child will do or will accomplish? We will never know unless that child is given his natural right to life. To take it away because it is either inconvient to the parents, or based on the belief that the child will have a terrible life is selfish and absurd. And, no, I am not saying that a child who is not my own would not be worth my time. However, I am saying that if I would want a son or daughter, I would produce it myself. If my wife were unable to concieve, than I would be more than willing to adopt. Also, you must admit that there is a distinct difference between producing your own child and adopting. You can watch your child grow from being a twinkle in mommies eye, to a fantastic adult. That's something special that can not be experienced through adoption.
fwegan: In addition, yes I do believe in birth control, but relating that to abortion is absurd and ridiculous. A idea of a child is realized at conception. Therefore, I will continue to support the use of any drug or form of birth control used to prevent conception. However, anything used after conception is abortion and is wrong. And, in these cases, they are not unborn babies, because they are not even concieved. Basically, you are saying that if one even thinks about sex, but doesn't do it, then that would be similar to the effects of birth control. I hope you see the error of your ways now, but I'd guess not.
abortion in my head is just an easy way out! if you had spread you legs you wouldn't be in this problem. It was your fault for not being responsible enough to actually have some form of protection and somthing for it and now you are taking the cowards way out.It is jsut plain horrible to me.
I've heard this argument a lot in here: "if you don't want a baby, don't have sex!"
Is there really a need to be so dramatic about it? Come on, we ALL know that there's such a thing as birth control, and less of us know that when properly used, condoms, the pill, and other methods can be totally effective. There's no need to not have sex.
"it's the mother's decision whether or not she wants the child..." "Both people consented to having sex, why shouldn't the father have any say? The effects of abortion on a father can be just as damaging as the effects on a mother."
well, I have to but in on this one. BTW, I'm pro-choice. I'm a mother of 2 wonderful boys, & I'd trade nothing for them. And I truly loved their fathers, (yes there's 2 fathers). Listen to these "damaging effects": Both men told me "I want this child, this family. If you abort it, I'll never be able to look at you again. I swear I'll be there for you...<ooh, most popular>> I love you!" I'm sure there are good men in the world, who should get a say, but most of them will run no matter what decision is made.
"adoption is just going to crowd the world and take up more space as oppsed to killing." "No, having sex and producing children is going to crowd up the world."
Okay, I do agree on the already over crowded system, but italian guy has a point. u go 9, 10 months and at the end you say well I don't want it, would you kill it?? I'm pro-choice because of the exceptions: rape, incest, molestation, complications. about the adoption thing--some would rather a child live out his entire life in foster homes, not really loved by anyone, and the other would rather end the pain B4 the fetus is even a fetus.
"If women who want children would just adopt, the the world wouldn't be overcrowded like it is now..." Its not so easy to adopt, you know. It actually takes years on a waiting list, and you have to be married, no record, perfect person, good driving record, etc! "I'm sorry buddy, but if I want to have a child, it's going to be my own, not someone elses" So, what you mean to say that a child isn't worth your time & love unless he/she comes from your own sperm/egg
"Let's just go kill innocent children because they are inconvient to my lifestyle." Or let them live a lifetime alone, no family. And I mean it, alot of foster parents seem perfect until the child turns up beaten & bruised, pregnant, and eventually dead. Where's the love in either scenario??? Faula420@earthlink.net
If it's wrong to scrape a tiny embryo, is it also wrong to use any form of birth control? I mean, after all, all the "would-be babies" are being killed in the process. Is it wrong to use the morning after pill? When, in your mind, does it become absolutely and completely wrong? When is it okay?
Joey: You mentioned that you think the mother and father should have equal say in deciding whether to get an abortion or not. I agree that it should be more or less a mutual decision, but you can't deny that it's HER body -- how does that NOT give her the final decision? Please don't tell me I'm selfish in feeling this way, I honestly don't believe that to be the case.
Psycho: I really do care. I think it's sad. However, I think it's more sad when a woman has to put her life on hold, or completely change it because the condom broke or whatever.
"What happens, though, if you're a 13 year old and u get pregnant... I mean seriously dude, ur parents hafta take kare of it, not u..."
That's not necessarily true. Some parents would support the pregnancy, but not care for the baby. In this case, the true mother would have to care for the baby. Besides, if we don't like the way someone is because it is inconvienient we should just kill them? Furthermore, why are 13 year olds having sex. Sure, I know it happens, but if a 13 year old girl is having sex, unprotected, and gets pregnant, then she should learn one of life's most valuable lessons, you must take responsibility for your own actions.
"and further more, some people just aren't physically or mentally able to handle children let alone have their own..."
Well, then they shouldn't have made the decision to have sex. If these people honestly are not ready to have children, then they should have sex because, just for your information, sex produces children. If you want to have sex for pleasure, that's fine, but if something happens and the woman gets pregnant, then you had better learn to live with that consequence for your action, because if you both consent to having sex, then you must understand the risks involved.
"it's the mother's decision whether or not she wants the child..."
Why? Both people consented to having sex, why shouldn't the father have any say? The effects of abortion on a father can be just as damaging as the effects on a mother. Furthermore, this, along with all of your other views, are incredibly selfish.
"adoption is just going to crowd the world and take up more space as oppsed to just killing off unwanted offspring."
No, adoption is not going to crowd the world, having sex and producing children is going to crowd up the world. You are truly ignorant if you can not see this fact. And as for killing off unwanted offspring, you're sick. What happens if the child is born, and then the parents decide that they don't want the child, should they be able to kill it because it is "unwanted offspring?"
"If women who want children would just adopt, the the world wouldn't be overcrowded like it is now..."
Now let's think about this one chief. I want a child, so I should just adopt. Or, I want a son/daughter, so I will have sex with my wife/girlfriend/aquantice to produce such a child. I'm sorry buddy, but if I want to have a child, it's going to be my own, not someone elses (unless, in the rare case that my wife would not be able to concieve). Now, once again, the world wouldn't be overcrowded if teens and/or other's made responible choices about sex. When doing anything, you have to understand the benfits and the risks involved. And if the risks outweigh the benefits, sometimes it is better to not do the activity. In this case, if you don't want to get pregnant, then the answer is simple: Don't have sex. If you seriously believe that adoption is a problem, then there is a simpler and more cost-efficient alternative to abortion: Don't have sex. Honestly, it is appaling that someone could have such self-centered views. Let's just go kill innocent children because they are inconvient to my lifestyle. Give me a break, once again, I must remark that abortion is the ultimate cop-out.
i'm 100% pro-chioce. i'm not saying that i think abortion is ok, and that it should be used as another way of birth control. but i think every woman sould have the choice whether or not they want to keep the baby. making a law that would force a person to carry a child she does not want is not right. anyways, if they make abortions illegal, people will still find someway to get one. when abortion was illegal, people who coud afford abortion (rich people) recieved one anyway. basically, if abortion becomes illegal rich people will have no problem with getting abortions, but people who cannot afford it will end up having tons of kids.
the vast majority of abortions occur before the fetus is recognizable as a human fetus; the use of "scissors" to "cut" the brain is such an extreme example of abortions - most abortions are accomplished by scraping off the embryo off of the uterine wall and using suction to vacuum out the cells. the pictures of discarded baby parts and "scissors" cutting through a fetus are largely decades old; many states currently require special permission to terminate a pregnancy past the 25th week and they almost universally serve to protect the health of the pregnancy woman.
I wonder if there's a correlation between gender and opinion on abortion. I'd bet there is (it's a lot easier to say abortion is wrong if it's impossible for you to ever have one), but I don't have the stamina to go through and tally up the posts on this board -- I was thinking of it, but BAH!
Well by the time the scissors are removing the brain I think it's safe to say the pain is far gone. Actually, until about 25 weeks in theres not enough neural connections or brain development to recognize pain. First you'd need nerves and connections. Additionally, animals feel pain but we kill them. There must be something else that would make it wrong to kill. Pain is not an objective standard to evaluate wrongness accurately.
aah, this topic is hella long. no way can i read through all this right now. im sure what i believe has already been stated. so i'll go ahead and just say im pro-choice. how can you trust me with a child if you cant trust me with a choice?
quote: is that not a person with rights and a person that has the right to life liberty and the persuit of happiness.[sic]
Actually no, in the eyes of the law it's not a person or else killing it would be a crime and you mother would be in prison (along with thousands of women) and you would be in foster care (along with millions of unwanted children).
Use the words correctly; I repeat: killing babies is called "infanticide" (because it happens to infants, not fetuses).
i think that anyone that has abortions is a cold hearted murderer. unless you were raped and then only if it is completely nessecary. my mother has had 2 abortions and that makes me mad knowing that i could has had brothers and sisters like everyone else and not be an only child. the fact that she thought about doing that makes me sick because how can you kill something as precious and pure and perfect as a baby. taht baby will never reach its full pontental. will never graduate at the head of its class never run for president and that really makes me mad. i know people out there say "its her boy she can do what she wants with it" but what about the unborn child that is growing inside of her. is that not a person with rights and a person that has the right to life liberty and the persuit of happiness. if that is so then how can you deny life to that unborn child for your own needs? abortions are not birth control. the best way not to need to have an abortion is not to get pregnat and the best way to do that is not have sex. then we wouldn't be having this conversation and babies wouldn't be dying.
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