Wow!! Every one has alot to say about this. i just sat here and read some pretty harsh stuff. i believe that abortion is wrong. and for that very reason i will fight tooth and nail to prove what i believe. i believe that if God didn't want you to have a baby he wouldn't have given it to you. if you got raped and you don't think that you can have the baby; give it up for adoption. if you were just stupid and layed down with someone not expecting to get pregnant but you did; well that would now be your responsibility and you now have to deal with that. a life is a life no matter where it may be in the world. God commanded that thou shalt not murder and abortion is so murder.
so just remember the decision might be yours right now but you will have to answer for that decision when you get to heaven and face GOD!!!

That was a very interesting analysis, BirdyGirl. I've never heard of lexigramming, very neat stuff. I didn't need any more convincing, though. I am all for women's rights, especially reproductive ones.

I like! How you phrased! Everything with! An exclamation point! It showed! How you are! Very excited! About life! And about the things! You believe in!

OK, now back to the (serious) topic at hand. Just wanted to joke a bit...

Okay! I am new to all this and I didn't even read any of your messages and I didn't need to... I already know how I feel! Abortion is murder! I don't care if the girl was raped or what, it is not the childs fault!! To take away a human beings life like that would be the same as haveing the child and shooting in the head a couple weeks later! Isn't that cruel...well so is abortion! And if it is some stupid teen who says she can't give the baby a good life then there are plenty of people out there that can and that is what abortion is for! The girl shouldn't have opened her legs if she wasn't ready for the responsibility and she knew she couldn't take care of the child! This subject just completely outrages me! I think that the child should have a chance! There is not one person in this world that would wish that their mother had aborted them! And if there is then there is only one word..TROUBLED! I could go on forever about this but I won't! So.. I am just gonna go and I will check-up on this board later! Peace!
(Oh yeah!! Bin Laden is a **** suckin *****)
Ashley

I recently read an interesting passage in a book called Star Signs by the late Linda Goodman. In this passage, she describes an esoteric technique called lexigramming, which is just like anagramming. The only difference is that lexigramming is used to determine the truths of the word being lexigrammed. I will directly quote from her book about the word abortions .

"Shall we take a much longer trip by spiralling a particular nine-letter word? Yes, let's. Because the word I have in mind is one which is currently causing a vast amount of tragic controversy all over the world, in both a religious and a medical sense. Abortions.

We'll Lexigram the plural of the word, not the singular, since we're going to try to discover in the world will lead us into illumination by giving us a reliable cosmic answer to the pros and cons of the issue---and that issue is not just about one single abortion (which may have various justifications) but to abortions, plural, as they are presently being attacked by the Right To Lifers and defended by those who champion women's rights over their own bodies.

Are abortions morally defensible---or a sin against defenseless human life? Are abortions murder? As always, the word itself possesses the answer, as it defines its own true meaning, hidden within the alphabetical letters composing it. The word "abortions" offers us a coded solution to the raging abortion issue, seeded by the recent emancipation of women. Some of you will be greatly comforted by the answer given so clearly in the word's Lexigram; others of your will be resentful for that answer. Speaking to the latter group, please keep in mind that the answer has no relation whatsoever to my own personal feelings, prejudice or lack of prejudice. The answer comes directly from the wisdom of the word druids [the word druids are supposedly the creators of the secret messages hidden in each Lexigram].

...One more request. If you're a Right to Lifer, and become offended at any particular pint along the way of our spiralling, stay with us. You hate being called prejudiced, don't you? The only way you can prove you don't deserve such an insulting label is to first pay close attention, with an open mind, to the counsel offered by the word druids, and immediately following it by astrology----and then make your decision, based on all the information available, not just part of it.

The Lexigram of ABORTIONS does not quibble about the answer to this issue. Its revelation is quite emphatic, leaving no room for doubt or dispute.

ABORTIONS

It lexigrams into the following words.

IT IS TORN. IT IS NOT BORN. IT IS A ROBOT.
A ROBOT IS NOT BORN--NO SIN
IS ABORTION A SIN? NO. IT IS NOT A SIN.

The Zebra Rule applies here: When a negative word (like NO or NOT) appears while the word YES does not appear, it means that the person or word will have been accused of whatever the negative word implies, but is not guilty.

...First, let's spiral into the pages of good old Noah Webster's rule book, which usually does not contradict the druid dictionary (it just doesn't reveal as much as the latter). Webster has the following comments to help us define further what our Abortions Lexigram called the entity which is aborted: a Robot.

Robot: a machine that looks like a human being, and performs various acts of a human being, but is without human emotions. A mechanism guided by automatic controls.

...Does the Webster definition of "robot" relate to the fetus in the womb? Yes, it does. The fetus looks like a human, and performs various acts of a human while immersed in fluid in the uterus, but is yet without human emotions, and is guided, most definitely, by automatic controls, those controls being in the hands of a particular Spirit or Higher S-elf, who has decided to build this house, this flesh temple (the body is the Temple of the soul---and Spirit---and Mind), and to take up residence when it's completed."

This being a little more metaphysical than physical, skeptics of the esoteric science can take this or leave this. I thought it was a pretty good argument, though, especially coming from the previously "hokey" department of New Age. I have not done anything but leave out subject change passages. Just think about this, all righty?

This is a topic upon which I can kind of speak from a personal perspective.
I was adopted at the age of 7 weeks. However, my Birthmom certainly could have chosen to ABORT me instead of put me up for adoption. I could be dead right now. But obviously I'm not because God has a plan for every life... including mine. So don't say it's a nice choice for the mom to have, cuz it's not. 200,000 mommies and daddies out there are waiting for a baby to love and take care of!!!
Plus: that "thing" that the doctor kills could have been the next president of the US, could have been a famous singer or speaker or author, could have discovered a cure for AIDS or cancer or some other disease, could have invented some world-changing invention, could have done any number of things, even just touched one person's life for the better... but now they are DEAD. ABORTION doesn't spell CHOICE, it spells MURDER.

Kahira
What do you want the 16 year old mothers who want a good life to do if they shouldn't put the child up for adoption?

Good post,Angelface.
And the mother does not have the right to have her baby killed-besides most abortions aren't because the mother got raped-they're because she had unprotected sex with someone she probably didn't trust enough to spend the rest of her life with,or didn't even like,or was too young or "unprepared" to handle the responsibilities her actions resulted in;or the prophylactic failed(and it happens fairly often).I say that,at the very least,if you can't wait until you love and respect someone enough to marry them before you get naked together,then wait until you know you can handle things if the going gets rough.

Having abortion as a choice is probably one of the reasons so many people are doing the dirty with so many partners(at separate times or simultaneously)-they can just run away from responsibility!And this careless attitude has already led to widespread disrespect(among what seems to be most people,though not all)and soooooo
many STDs!

You pro-choice people out there:someone made a good point-are you the same as your mother?No,you're walking around on your own now-you're not her property to love or discard at will.As for whoever said that a baby's a baby once it comes out of the womb-well,which month is THAT?I have a friend who was born perfectly healthy at 6 months.Some abortions take place at that stage of pregnancy.How can you say that's NOT MURDER???

Another thing.I don't think the baby should be given up for adoption unless you literally can't feed it;after all who knows if the kid'll end up with child molesters,abusers,or someone just trying out for a kid who might give them back like they're badly-fitting Christmas gifts?(no offense to all the kids with wonderful adoptive parents out there).Besides,I don't think that anything makes up for having an extended family that you know loves you no matter how annoying you are(yeah,you can get that from an adoptive family,but I still couldn't miss out on all the genetic similarites(oh my God,she's doing the exact same thing her aunt did,and they never met!)

So what if the kid gets born really poor or in a bad neighborhood?It could still grow up fabulous-it all depends on how much faith the family have and the kid's inner strength.

Some people are poor and extremely down on their luck but still happier than all the rich-plenty-of-oppurtunity-but-still-throwing-it-away people!!!Think about it.

YES,I DO KNOW I RAMBLE ON FAR TOO LONG!!!!(sorry;but I usually only answer posts I feel strongly about.And then I need to clarify my point)

wow, you said exactly what all those other pro-abortion (fine... "pro choice"...even though killing a baby should not even be a choice....) people said. If you go back and read all my posts you can see my response to that ever so common pro-choice argument.

but uh...if you say so... go ahead, have an abortion... i won't stop you.

i'm sick of arguing the same stuff over and over again.

God bless.

calling abortion the holocaust of our time is ridiculous it doesn't even come close! i'm pro-choice because i value the fact that the u.s. is a free country. all of these pro-lifers can be freaky. i understand its religious beliefs and all the other stuff but who has the right to tell a fifteen year old girl that she can't have an abortion or a rape victim or any other woman. the beauty about living here is that we have choices. if we begin to make restrictions upon what we want to do to our own bodies than we're only a step closer to being a dictatorship and that would really f***in suck!

have you NEVER had kettle chips? heard of them?

maybe they're only in California? no... i doubt that....anyways.

I've explained abortion, using both spiritual and non spiritual explanations. You are using circular reasoning. You can go back and read my explanations if you wish to continue this further. But I have just stated my points, and I'm done explaining this to people who don't want to hear it.

What do you mean kettle chips??????? OKAY, please humor me here, explain the bad side of abortion without using religion and a satanic destiny.

i could go for some kettle chips.

Liberalchick, the parents could give the child up for adoption instead of going through the process of abortion. Yes you are right, they could be saving it from the pain and embarrassment and other things, but I would still prefer giving it up for adoption!

liberalchic,
you said the woman should have rights over her BODY. A baby is NOT just another organ in her body, since organs have no potential of ever being humans, and fetuses do. The baby inside a mother depends on the mother, but is not PART of the mother. It is not her right to get rid of it. Sure, she can get rid of her liver or heart if she wants to, that's fine. But a baby is NOT "part" of her, as many of you have said.

As for the destiny, well, if I explain this you'll get all weird about it because it will sound too religious for you, but here goes:

God has a destiny for each of us....and its good; however, the devil ALSO has a destiny. If we choose to reject God's gift of salvation, then we yield ourselves over to Satan's destiny for our lives, instead of God's.

I am not denying it is a life, if I did I would be acting stupid. It is a life, and I think the fetis could grow up to be a peacemaker, a mass murderer, and hobo, a president, an actor, etc. , but the life that is already in place ( the mother) is first priority. They have worked hard to build up their lives, and to bring a child into the world when they cannot raise it is a mistake.

A woman should have the choice to have a child or not, right? If they do not want to have
a baby, why is it fair to take away that right? A woman deserves freedom over their body,
and their eggs.

Okay, please explain this whole "God's plan" thing. If god plans a person's destiny, and they cannot change that destiny, then isn't it their destiny to abort a child? Isn't it a killer's destiny to kill? Isn't it an athiest's destiny to not believe? Isn't it my destiny to be typing this???????????? Please explain your belief!

I think that at conception a cell is not human, it is a cell. However, it is the potential for a human, and who are we to deny that potential?

I have said this before, but it's not our decision whether that child was destined for a short stay on earth of suffering or not. Perhaps that child was glad to have lived just for a short while. Perhaps he/she saw just one very beautiful thing, and was glad to have lived for it. You are not that child and you cannot decide for them.

I also am not the mother, so people say why should I decide for her? Well in that case, why do governments have restriction on murder? Why should we decide for killers choices? It's the same principle.

I am outraged that you said that it's better off to be aborted than living a life of the many children who don't have homes or families because they were given up for adoption. I was adopted, and I could've still been in an orphanage right now-how dare you suggest that I'd be better off aborted? Or my brother who was also adopted? And don't say that you didn't suggest that, because regardless of what you may say you meant, you inadvertently suggested that, and I am quite offended.

This thread is starting to just become everyone re-stating what's already been said.

saying that the child should live and get adopted makes sense, but there are more children that are alive that aren't going to be adopted than hopeful couples for adoption, so instead of getting adopted children end up on the street, that does not seem better than being aborted.

And now, I join this fiery debate.
Is it the public's choice whether or not a woman has an abortion? Should it not be the mother's choice? Abortion may be something that many people on this earth strongly disagree with, but the women, I believe, should be allowed to choose for themselves.
There are so many different potential situations in which an abortion may be considered. How can anyone else know what is best for a particular woman? If the child is born, unwanted, what will become of it?
Do you know what is horrifying to me? Unwanted children are sometimes deserted, left on the streets, in dumpsters, even. How is this better than the removal of the fetis, when the potential child does not feel pain? This can be no different than the murder which is described by pro-life advocates.
Young mother's may experience much trauma and emotional stress when they find themselves with the burden of a new-born child. That is when we find ourselves with young woman desparately trying to perform dangerous self-abortions, or abandoning their young. The child has indeed been given life. Anti-abortionists seem to find it a beeter alternative when the child is granted life, only to live sadly and die unhappily.
It is not anyone's choice except the mother's. They are the one's who must choose based on what their situation is, and whether they are capable of supporting a child, in order to give this child a fulfilling life. I think that women deserve the right to recieve consultation and information on abortions, and the right to choose what is best for themselves and for their child.
h

I am not a hypocrit thank you very much! A person who has feelings, emotion, a body, they are alive. But a fetis inside a mother's body is not a person!! Perhaps you could tell me that from the point of being fertilized with sperm the egg is human, but I think the fetis actually has to be out of a mother's womb to be human, that's my opinion.

Gooberflinch, I read the articles, but I am athiest so they didn't mean much to me.