Jean Jacques Rousseau believed that people are naturally good but that civilization and instiutions make them evil. Do you agree?

While this is true, there is an inherant fault. For without people who are naturally good, no one could have started society. Therefore one person at least must be naturally evil.

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Originally posted by bluedemocrat:
However, I do believe that humans are naturally competetive, jealous, and selfish. These traits can and do lead corruption.

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Human beings have those characteristics because nature still thinks we don't have enough food to go around.

Pity though...The survival instinct certainly seems to harm more than it helps. Unless of course you happen to be in imminent, life-threatening danger.

Transcendentalism at its best.

But no. I do not agree.

Humans are inherently neutral at the time of birth. Early childhood is a period of primal needs with no cognitive thought so it’s no really fair to say we are born good or evil. There is a lot more to this discussion but simply at birth humans are neutral. Furthermore you must also look at the fact that "society" is a very fickle thing. Ideas of good and evil are consistently changing in society. Society affects individuals and individuals affect society. Trying to decide which one has a greater effect is a chicken or egg debate. It’s impossible because from the very time of our birth both are present and both are ultimately made up of each other.

If humans are inherently good, but they form society, then wouldn't society be good like the humans? I don't believe that people are born evil. However, I do believe that humans are naturally competetive, jealous, and selfish. These traits can and do lead corruption. However, these traits can and do allow humans to achieve highly and ultimately suceed in life.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by st13245:
I belive human beings are born neutral.


You are basically saying that people are born without a personality. This can't be true because things that happen to a person helps shape your personality, they don't create it.

It doesn't make sense...if they are BORN good...why aren't we good? Think of it this way- When society started everyone would of been good...and so forth society remain so...so where does the bad come in? It takes something bad to make something bad...but on the toehr hand...something that is TOO good is bad. (no fun.) well...there's a paradox for you. Society.

~Katz

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Originally posted by risika2004:
I think it depends on the person.

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What do you mean?

I think it depends on the person.

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Originally posted by CelticNewAger:

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I agree but I think that it also depends on what they were raised to believe as good and bad. Some things in some enviroments are considered good, but may be considered bad in a different enviroment. The people in these enviroments influence the people we are and the people that we become.

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And culture.

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Oh yes,thank you! And culture.

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I agree but I think that it also depends on what they were raised to believe as good and bad. Some things in some enviroments are considered good, but may be considered bad in a different enviroment. The people in these enviroments influence the people we are and the people that we become.

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And culture.

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Originally posted by VoiceofAmerica:
A person is corrupt as a result of his own choices.

Society may make it easier for a person to be corrupt (via peer pressure), it is ultimately a person choices that make someone good or bad.

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I agree but I think that it also depends on what they were raised to believe as good and bad. Some things in some enviroments are considered good, but may be considered bad in a different enviroment. The people in these enviroments influence the people we are and the people that we become.

A person is corrupt as a result of his own choices.

Society may make it easier for a person to be corrupt (via peer pressure), it is ultimately a person choices that make someone good or bad.

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Is this person Evil if what they do causes them happiness?

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Serial kilers vary from case to case. You've got your revenge killer, you necrophile, the killer that just likes killing, the "you were at the wrong place at the wrong time" killer, the anger-management killer, the stalker killer. You can't make a group for these people. I think they're as personal and different as DNA in each person.

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One could argue that tolerance, at many times, is worse.

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I should have explained. The intolerance I meant was the intolerance for other religions, other cultures, other beliefs. of course there are some things you cannot tolerate, but the ones I mentioned I think you should.

I think AmericanVoice is close to the answer on this one.
In order to answer this question you must ask yourself what is "good" and what is "evil".
Every person, regardless of alignment, has a wish to be happy. Being happy is the basic motivator of human life, so we can say that happiness is good.
If happiness is good then we can equate other emotions with evil, such as sadness, anger, fear, things that are generally unpleasant.
If the above is true than an evil person would be someone whom not only has unpleasant feelings themself, but also causes unpleasant feelings in others. Many times we see serial killers, rapists, etc. that obtain joy and happiness in what they do. They do not do what they do in an effort to be unhappy, they do it to fulfill some base desire that ultimately results in pleasant feelings in some sick twisted way, although they cause unhapiness in others. Is this person Evil if what they do causes them happiness?

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Religion has created evil in a way. It brought up intolerance.

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One could argue that tolerance, at many times, is worse.

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Personally I agree with Rousseau. People often change in the enviroments that they are in. It's like living on the classy side of town then moving to the ghetto. Your not gonna really remain all that classy. With all the technology that we have today it brought along evil things with it. It's weird. Man I am soo tired! lol

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That happened to me. I moved from a fancy area in Puerto Rico to tragic Moscow. As bad as the conditions are and as dangerous as the place is, I'm gonna go back after the Holidays. It makes me feel good to view a different culture at its full angle, I feel that just coming to Russia and moving into a hotel wouldn't teach me anything.

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Man I am soo tired! lol

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Heh. I did not sleep last night. there were 2 great foreign films, one from Spain, the other from Austria, that just were too good to miss.

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Yes. Love, you can even see it in people if you have the ability, it's a beautiful thing. I personally find myself loving/caring people whose names I don't even know, it's very odd.

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I know what your saying and I agree. It's like you feel for them and sympathize what they are going through. I am often sensing a certain closeness to someone just by looking at them. It's crazy.
Personally I agree with Rousseau. People often change in the enviroments that they are in. It's like living on the classy side of town then moving to the ghetto. Your not gonna really remain all that classy. With all the technology that we have today it brought along evil things with it. It's weird. Man I am soo tired! lol

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Question for all: Is self love necessary to be a good person?

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Yes. Love, you can even see it in people if you have the ability, it's a beautiful thing. I personally find myself loving/caring people whose names I don't even know, it's very odd.

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Basically what I am saing is that I belive, in general (there are exceptions), that people start off as a clean slate, and what ever our actions are, they become our nature.

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Of course. It varies on culture, life expirience, etc, but I think we're all born innocent. Though I believe in past lives and that we remember them in a way, but that's another story.