Originally posted by ilovebush: yes, i understand weather is still unpredictable. but it isnt like Katrina was the first hurricane to ever hit the U.S. Ivan came not even a year earlier, and it was said to be a category 4 when it hit (which was bullcrap but whatever) and look at the destruction it left. If Mrs. Blanco couldnt see how much damage Ivan and Dennis left, then thats her own fault.
so there you acknowledge the unpredictable nature of hurricanes and natural disasters.
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That is complete bullcrap to say that Katrina went against everything the National Hurricane Center said. I live not 2 hours east of Biloxi (which got hit as bad as New Orleans did) and we even got a warning that we might need to evacuate.
"The initial National Hurricane Center forecasts predicted that Katrina would enter the Gulf of Mexico and begin turning northward, eventually hitting the Florida Panhandle. Katrina, however, continued a west track, eventually turning to the west-southwest. When the storm began turning to the northwest, New Orleans was its aim." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hurricane_Katrina
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My thing is that Mrs. Blanco waited too long to order an exacuation. If she would have issused it the hour she found out that Katrina was going to be a big one (which she was told it was going to be - you cant say she didnt), then I believe more people would have been saved.
If youre going to say that Bush was forced to take responsibilty for Katrina relief when Blanco wasnt doing her job the way she should have, then dont blame it all on him.
i never did. i implied that you could, but i never did.
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If she would have known what she was doing, as well as the New Orleans mayor, then Bush wouldnt have even been tangled in this whole mess.
so our president should not be involved in natural disasters beyond what we have ever seen before? that's illogical.
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(I'm sorry to say it) but this is why women arent always the best politicians - they take too long to consider things. but thats a whole other argument....
wow, you truly are an ignoramous. her being a woman had no effect on her decisions. that is stereotypical, rude, inappropriate, and downright stupid.
Weather is still incredibly unpredictable. i also never said that the weathermen and women were wrong. i said that mrs. blanco, a governor, could not have known how destructive it was going to be. hurricane-prone areas like louisiana get those type of warnings constantly.
yes, i understand weather is still unpredictable. but it isnt like Katrina was the first hurricane to ever hit the U.S. Ivan came not even a year earlier, and it was said to be a category 4 when it hit (which was bullcrap but whatever) and look at the destruction it left. If Mrs. Blanco couldnt see how much damage Ivan and Dennis left, then thats her own fault.
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august 26th, mrs. blanco ordered a state of emergency. august 27th, Bush ordered one. the NO mayor and mrs. blanco ordered a mandatory evacuation of the city.
That is complete bullcrap to say that Katrina went against everything the National Hurricane Center said. I live not 2 hours east of Biloxi (which got hit as bad as New Orleans did) and we even got a warning that we might need to evacuate. My thing is that Mrs. Blanco waited too long to order an exacuation. If she would have issused it the hour she found out that Katrina was going to be a big one (which she was told it was going to be - you cant say she didnt), then I believe more people would have been saved.
If youre going to say that Bush was forced to take responsibilty for Katrina relief when Blanco wasnt doing her job the way she should have, then dont blame it all on him. If she would have known what she was doing, as well as the New Orleans mayor, then Bush wouldnt have even been tangled in this whole mess. (I'm sorry to say it) but this is why women arent always the best politicians - they take too long to consider things. but thats a whole other argument....
Originally posted by ilovebush: have you ever seen a helicopter Kal? helicopters arent big enough to bring in near enough supplies to help the amount of people in New Orleans. And helicopters were being used to save people that spent days on top of roofs- which seems a little more important.
when the tsunami hit, do you remember how aid got to thouse countries? buses, trains, and boats couldn't get near the islands because of the devastation. planes and helicopters brought most of the aid to those nations.
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yes, maybe weather was more unpredictable 50 years ago.
don't patronize me. Weather is still incredibly unpredictable. i also never said that the weathermen and women were wrong. i said that mrs. blanco, a governor, could not have known how destructive it was going to be. hurricane-prone areas like louisiana get those type of warnings constantly.
i agree she didn't act quick enough, but she is not to hold the blame.
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If you remember, Katrina had already hit many islands, and the damage was outrageous. If someone doesnt know that a category 5 storm (actually anything higher than 3) will bring incredible destruction, they shouldnt be given the responsibility of Governor of a state.
you didn't do your research and that is very obvious. when hurricane katrina rolled through the bahamas, it was tropical depression 10. it hit miami, florida as a category 1 hurricane. the national hurricane center said it would go up the florida panhandle and weaken and dissipate. goshdarnit, wouldn't you know that stubborn hurricane didn't follow the NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER's well-researched thesis. so on august 27th, we had a category 3 goin' toward new orleans. within about four hours it intensified so much that it became a category 4 to 5.
august 26th, mrs. blanco ordered a state of emergency. august 27th, Bush ordered one. the NO mayor and mrs. blanco ordered a mandatory evacuation of the city.
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how? when the Governor said she would take responsibilty for Katrina, then the blame should be put on her, not the President of our nation, who offered to take responsibilty.
she did not offer, she accepted. he did not offer, he was forced.
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I hear both sides to stories, decide which one I agree with, and then start my argument - maybe you should do the same.
you need to cut the patronizing attitude.
bush needn't take all the responsibility, neither should mrs. blanco. but to say bush did ALL he could, is a lie.
Ill make this short quick and to the point, Bush kinda failed, but there are many others to blame too. Yes, we should have had more people down there. But that is all done with. 1)We need to take our boys outta the Mid East and get them here. 2) People in New Orleans need to fill their bellies and get to go, get some gumption, grab a shovel, and start diggin. Or whatever else needs to be done. Im sorry if I am being offensive, and no, im not racist. I know there are some people trying to rebuild, but everyone needs to work together like back in kindergarden. Thats my beliefs, and Im sorry if Ive hurt anyones feelings.
and the government has no access to helicopters, of course.
have you ever seen a helicopter Kal? helicopters arent big enough to bring in near enough supplies to help the amount of people in New Orleans. And helicopters were being used to save people that spent days on top of roofs- which seems a little more important.
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you expect a hurricane-prone area to be able to detect with "category 5"'s are more dangerous than the others? weather, second to love, is the most unpredictable thing we have in our world. she could not have known how destructive it was.
yes, maybe weather was more unpredictable 50 years ago. But unlike love, hurricanes have been studied, and meterologists have a lot more technology than they used to, and can tell what category a hurricane will be. If you remember, Katrina had already hit many islands, and the damage was outrageous. If someone doesnt know that a category 5 storm (actually anything higher than 3) will bring incredible destruction, they shouldnt be given the responsibility of Governor of a state.
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And yes, maybe relief efforts were slow, but you cant blame our President for that.
yeah you can.
how? when the Governor said she would take responsibilty for Katrina, then the blame should be put on her, not the President of our nation, who offered to take responsibilty. However, she didnt want to give up that power. All relief efforts were her duty - not George Bush's.
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that was ignorant and offensive. maybe you should stop getting your news from underneath bush's desk, or FOX.
I dont care if it was offensive or not - its the truth. I have had way too many debates with people my age that try to get all their news information from MTV. And by the way, I watch CNN, as well as FOX, on a daily basis. I hear both sides to stories, decide which one I agree with, and then start my argument - maybe you should do the same.
Originally posted by ilovebush: okay first of all, I doubt half of yall have actually been through a hurricane, so dont blame anyone for the delay of relief - its not easy to bring in supplies when you cant get to certain cities because bridges have collapsed and there are huge trees blocking roads.
and the government has no access to helicopters, of course.
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The governor of Lousiana decided to take all responsibilites. She was contacted by the National Weather service a couple days before Katrina hit, and was told that it was going to be a category 5, and was headed straight for New Orleans and all the people in New Orleans and the surrounding areas needed to evacuate, and she also needed to call in the National Guard to help people leave. What did she do? She said she "had to think about it" and waited 24 hours to start any kind of evacuation. But mind you, she never contacted the National Guard. If she would have started reporting to the people of New Orleans that they needed to obviously evacuate the minute she got the news about Katrina, I bet hundreds of people would have been saved. It was her responsibility, as well as the mayor of New Orleans, to keep their people safe. She had a parking lot full of school buses just sitting there - they could have easily been used to get the lower half of New Orleans out. It wasnt until after the storm, that Bush realized she wasnt doing her job that he stepped in and took control.
and this is not coming from the fact that mrs. blanco is a centrist and not a neo-con like bush and your bias.
you expect a hurricane-prone area to be able to detect with "category 5"'s are more dangerous than the others? weather, second to love, is the most unpredictable thing we have in our world. she could not have known how destructive it was.
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And yes, maybe relief efforts were slow, but you cant blame our President for that.
yeah you can.
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And if youre even going to start saying this is a race issue, you need to stop getting your news information from the 30 second briefs in-between Laguna Beach and Real World on MTV and actually watch an unbiased news program for once in your ignorant little life.
that was ignorant and offensive. maybe you should stop getting your news from underneath bush's desk, or FOX.
okay first of all, I doubt half of yall have actually been through a hurricane, so dont blame anyone for the delay of relief - its not easy to bring in supplies when you cant get to certain cities because bridges have collapsed and there are huge trees blocking roads. It took a lot of time to get relief efforts into my area after Ivan too.
And whoever is blaming Bush for the hurricane and the delays obviously didnt do their research. When disasters like this are about to hit, it is the state and local governments decision to either take responsibility for the aftermath and safety of their people, or to give up their responsibilities to the federal government. The governor of Lousiana decided to take all responsibilites. She was contacted by the National Weather service a couple days before Katrina hit, and was told that it was going to be a category 5, and was headed straight for New Orleans and all the people in New Orleans and the surrounding areas needed to evacuate, and she also needed to call in the National Guard to help people leave. What did she do? She said she "had to think about it" and waited 24 hours to start any kind of evacuation. But mind you, she never contacted the National Guard. If she would have started reporting to the people of New Orleans that they needed to obviously evacuate the minute she got the news about Katrina, I bet hundreds of people would have been saved. It was her responsibility, as well as the mayor of New Orleans, to keep their people safe. She had a parking lot full of school buses just sitting there - they could have easily been used to get the lower half of New Orleans out. It wasnt until after the storm, that Bush realized she wasnt doing her job that he stepped in and took control.
So youre going to blame Bush for all of this? I understand that after a major crisis, everyone looks for someone to blame. And yes, maybe relief efforts were slow, but you cant blame our President for that. And if youre even going to start saying this is a race issue, you need to stop getting your news information from the 30 second briefs in-between Laguna Beach and Real World on MTV and actually watch an unbiased news program for once in your ignorant little life.
i really think that Bush did negelect the people in new orleans. i know he is not fully responsible for all of those people dying...some of it is their faults....but i put most of the blame on bush...how is that when florida is hit by a hurricane he sends peole down right away to help the flordians.... is it because his brother is down there???? i think he should have been able to help those other people out...instead of helping third world countries,help our own damn country. if we can afford to give to others give to our own people.
People it's not bush's job all the stuff your talking about is the job of that states and the tragedy of New Orleans is also the state's fault they did not evacuate the people of New Orleans quickly enough and they (Gov of Louisanna) are at fault for the dams(levees?) collapsing they had been given federal funds years ago to have those walls reinforced but as this situation did not seem likely it(the money) got spent on pet projects through out the state.
Also for the Federal Govt. to respond the state must request it and the state did not request federal help until two days after the fact.
There are several things which occurred before the New Orleans disaster that indicated that this was going to happen. Some scientists even made a dead on prediction of this. Bush didn't give much heed to this because he had a "war on terror" to wage. Is there anyone here who even buys into that crap about fighting terror? Terror is an abstract concept, people, so tell me, how does one go about fighting that?
Anyway, back to Katrina. Actually, scientists predicted this, and this info was relayed to Pres Bush. But he had dedicated a large portion of FEMA’s funds to the war in Iraq, as a result, there weren’t sufficient funds to put toward relief efforts. Hence the slop and crap that followed. Also, there had been a practice evacuaton for such a disaster in New Orleans with a fictional Hurricane Pam. Ask the question, if they couldn’t have predicted the disaster, why did they have this exercise?
And the levees were well overdue for fixing anyway. The whole of New Orleans and the Bush administration knew that.
It's a trend that I have noticed with governments though, especially in the US. Oh my Lord!! ESPECIALLY IN THE U.S.!!! They use some very general, umbrella terms to shroud the specifics which they do not want the public to know. Like what war is Bush really fighting? What is his REAL motive? If you recall, it used to be Osama bin Laden and Al Qaeda that he was so adamant against, but after two years of searching, and not finding Osama, and not making much headway with Al Qaeda either, he suddenly changed his talk to fighting terror. And we bought it, too. We hardly realized that this government had moved into the realm of the ridiculous, and somehow brought a whole nation with it.
It is really sad that it took this many years and that many American soldiers, and that much more Iraqi lives before a nation began to question the motives of its government, and to realize their great error. It is very sad indeed.
I believe that Bush reacted way too slow.....i mean way too slow....he waited too many days to pass to send out the resucing team.....i can't believe him....
Please realise that Mississippi got the worst blow out of this, I'm from Mississippi, My town is gone now, gone the only left our concrete slabs, New Orleans is one city about a dozen got nearly wiped out in Mississippi, But all the news wanted to talk about was New Orleans, Please don't forget Mississippi, WE GOT FAILED TOO.
Race was not a great factor contributing to the inefficacy of FEMA or the government, but I do believe that the mentioning of it as a factor made all of us realize the tentative relations between races. It may have been chaotic, but it brings forth a delicate issue that must be dealt with to improve how all americans interact with each other for a better understanding of who we are as one.. Having a news caster talking about the victims as "So poor and so black.." may have brought attention to the issue of how subtle racial profiling has become.. non? I feel that the focus on race was overracting though, because the main issue here was (poor) preparedness.
and to amp.. (correct me if i'm wrong) but i do not believe the whole city is below sea level. (if it is then my bad) the most affected areas were those built below sea level, and these were where most of the middle to low class residents were.. i believe it was out of necessity that they lived there and it was not about choice, so many factors come into choice that you cannot just assume that they could just pick up and leave whenever they felt like it...
Hi, I live in Baton Rouge and I don't feel that the Government failed the people of New Orleans. Do wish that things were handled better, yes. Do i wish that things were handled faster, yes. But I truly believe that no one was ready for anything on this scale. There has never been anything this major on American soil. Trust me, living this close to New Orleans, every one thought it would happen, but no one thought it could and would happen now. I truly believe that this was not a case of racisim or classicism. But from here on in, everyone will be prepared and know how to react to something like this, if it happens again. May i also say that i am black.
And I can agree with that 100%. The system failed the New Orleans citizens drastically. The "blame game" of the situation is an understatement. Clearly there is blame on all levels of Gov't. here, but none mostly greater than that of the federal gov't. It shows the lack of adherance and empathy on the part of the Bush administration; to concur and conclude that there was an credible and visible break down in the preparedness and response to the situation. If we can't effectively adapt to the reality and broad scope of a natural disaster, how can we effectively, and accurately respond to the magnitude of another terrorist attack?
And I can agree with that 100%. The system failed the New Orleans citizens drastically. The "blame game" of the situation is an understatement. Clearly there is blame on all levels of Gov't. here, but none mostly greater than that of the federal gov't. It shows the lack of adherance and empathy on the part of the Bush administration; to concur and conclude that there was an credible and visible break down in the preparedness and response to the situation. If we can't effectively adapt to the reality and broad scope of a natural disaster, how can we effectively, and accurately respond to the magnitude of another terrorist attack?
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