Here's a question: would you rather have more kids in daycares than with their moms, or the widely accepted thought that women are only good at washing dishes? Think about that. I have an old ('60s-ish) game of Battleship. On it is a family. The dad and son are playing Battleship, whilst in the background are the mom and daughter happily--get this, happily!--washing the dishes. Is that better than moms going to work?

Perhaps a family of four in the '60s could live on a single income (that of the father). That was also when gas cost less than a dollar a gallon and you could buy a month's worth of groceries for $50. Today, that does not ring true. Groceries for a family of four for a month can cost upwards of $100. Gas is going on $3 a gallon. The cost of living has greatly increased. How to cope with that? Seeing a lack of higher-paying jobs for the dad, the mom will work, thus bringing in an extra $20,000-$50,000 a year, give or take. That way, the family won't be out on the street, or living in a single-wide on the other side of the tracks.

But I still stand by what I said a while back. Our country's troubles began when it was founded, nay, when it was discovered. Not when the cost of living increased and we had to cope with it.

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Children are now either spending 75% of their time at daycares or with other sorts of babysitters - maybe siblings... Mother/Daughter relationships are going to hell because when a mother gets home from working - all they want to do is relax.

Um, most of the best friends I have now are those who I bonded with when we spend many shared hours in an after-school thing. And I thank God everyday that I had to go through those years because my friends are so dear to me.

And also, although it's true that the mothers now want to relax, that doesn't mean the Mother/Daughter relationships have gone to hell. You make it sound as if they're not entitled to feeling stressed and wanting to spend a couple nights a week laying on the sofa and just talking instead of going somewhere.

Joey, please tell me how you felt about the 9/11 terrorist attack?

Because my mother works anywhere from 50-hour weeks to 70-hours trying to protect our country from future terrorism.

She works at the State Departement, Washington D.C. She works on files about terrorists and their actions. She reviwes what they have done and what they will do in the future. She tracks down where terrorists are and puts them in jail.

On top of ALL OF THAT, she comes home every night and has us all sit down at the dinner table to eat together. We never eat unless everyone is home (or unless she's comming home REALLY late) and have been brought up with excellent manners.

And besides, are you saying that dad's can't be a supportive role-model in the parenting process? My dad's a teacher so he comes hom early and cooks dinner and cleans the house. I guess, in my family, the roles are somewhat reversed. But taht doesn't mean we're any less of a family.

So, NOW why don't you tell me mom's should still be at home. Just TRY.

Joey, if you were a woman would you still say that women should just stay at home and not pursue their career dreams if they have them???

excuse me!!!! just because dysfunctional families were not the stereotype of the 1950's does not mean they never happened! There was still abuse and alcoholism, prostitution, rebellious teens, and yes even divorce in that era and for many years before. Do you blame women for a country's wars, famines, depressions, and all other troubles? How can you say that when the united states has never had a female president, canada has only ever had one and she had no chance at keeping her position, and the monarchy of other countries have only ever allowed women on the throne were she to have no brothers.
Women have fought for their rights, and are still fighting. Question, if women really are the cause of a country's troubles because she left the home to work, why then are some (not all, but still kind of a general statement, my apolegies) Islamic countries still at war if their women are forced under the veil, and have an extremely difficult time of finding any kind of work that is permitted by thier extremist government.
The past is the past and should not be forgotten but used to correct the mistakes of the future before we make them. Look at all the influential men and women around you and realize all the good that both sexes have accompished by working together. so get up from your computer and deal! There's so much more out there for a woman with the courage to try anything than a sexist man with nothing.

~*enlighten me, for im starving to know*~

No every one stop this thread was dead stop bringing it back!

You guys are stupid. Joey isn't being sexist, he's just stating the half-truth. Problems didn't start because of that. It happened with Women argued that they should be able to divorce during the womens rights movement (on which I agree with on several things), and men agreed, so now, 1 out of 3 children and teenagers have a stepparent, live with one single parent, or alternate between the two. That is not all women's fault.

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our problems did not start when women worked out of the home. it was when men thought they were better, and did not think they had to help raise the kids outside of the money sit.

Can anyone say sexist?

Our country's problems started when a bunch of Vikings sailed across the Atlantic and discovered it. End of story.

no stop let this thread DIE! please just let this thread die

since in sosiety today it takes 2 people to raise a child how come you are blaming the mom. even if she did stay home the father still would be out of the picture. when men take it upon themselves to be the ones to bring all the overtime money home they're tired,lazy,cranky. so they wont talk to thier kids. our problems did not start when women worked out of the home. it was when men thought they were better, and did not think they had to help raise the kids outside of the money sit.

"As the FAMILY goes, so goes the nation and so goes the whole world in which we live."
-Pope John Paul II

"FAMILY, nature, and health all go together"
-Olivia Newton-John

"You don't choose your FAMILY. They are GOd's gift to you, as you are to them."
-Desmond Tutu

"The FAMILY is the first essential cell of human society."
-Pope John XXIII

"The other night I ate at a real nice FAMILY restaurant. Every table had an argument going."
-George Carlin

Joey you are a sick sexist *******!!! If it weren't for women working you probably wouldn't even be here today!! By the way, why are you so sexist??

Okay. This is totally a rant. There is no way you can say with any surety that every time a kid gets spanked it is pepetuating a system of abuse and crime, if only because you cannot be in every household and understand every situation. And where exactly do you get your vague statistics that most of the kids being hit do drugs and commit suicide? Perhaps that's true of children getting beaten, but I doubt the truth of that.
I personally, as well as my brothers, were spanked as children. We were spanked after repeated warnings, and never because my parents were just plain mad at us. We knew the we were doing wrong. We'd been told if we did it again that we would spanked. And we did. So we were asking for it. My dad and I just had a conversation about this a few days ago. He said the whole purpose of the spanking was to birng of back to having a tender, obedient heart. He would spank until we "gave up" and acknowledged that we were wrong. With me, this would often only take one spank. Then, he would hold us for as long as we wanted so that we would know that we he loved us and we were okay, that he wans't mad and we were back to the same place we were before we got in trouble. With me and one of my brothers, after a spanking we would cuddle for a really long time, often long enough that my dad was ready to go play before we were. He made certain that he never spanked us if he had an agenda, because it would hurt the relationship if he was the one to push us away.
I always felt very close to him after I was spanked, because I knew that there were boundaries, and rules, which made me feel safe, and also because he loved me enough to go throgh the whole process. I was never hit in the face. I was never hit anywhere but the bottom, and I never had bruises or pain. I never felt that my dad didn't love me or that I was being punished wrongly. I never thought that I must be a bad kid. I never thought that he was doing it cause he was mad at me. I don't think you can say this is a form of child abuse. What would have been child abuse is letting me do whatever I want, not teaching me that breaking rules have consequences. If he had been able to do this with timeouts or whatever, great. But it's not liek that with every child. And I don't think it's fair to not give your child any consequences for doing wrong, and let them grow up taking advantage of authority. Then when they get into serious trouble and end up in jail, they're going to find out exactly what abuse is. And it's not what I got at home.

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Originally posted by californiapro:
To the issue on spanking weater or not the parent has a reason for hitting their child it doesnt make it right and the only way the law would do any thing about it was because kids ended up in hospital because nothing can justify a child of any age being hit i see kids as young as two years old being hit because they have done some thig wrong but hitting only makes matters worse because the child is highsteracal from being hit parents are supposed to protect their children from this sort of behavior not subject them to it this will only be carried through the childs life to adult hood where they will hit their kids just the same as their parents did to them and they wont see any thing wrong with it till they are in court fighting for custody of their child when the state is trying to take the child of the parent because that child was in hospital from withstaining injurs like broken ribs or broken arm because the parents got so used to hitting that child and the child got used to it that the parents say to themselves this child is not learning so the parents hit harder and befor we know it that child has died so some one try and tell me that any form of hitting a child is not abuse and by the way the kids that get hit are mostly the types of kids that do drugs and take their own lives

Now that mom's go to work, alot of things have gone wrong, (yes, I agree) - Children are now either spending 75% of their time at daycares or with other sorts of babysitters - maybe siblings... Mother/Daughter relationships are going to hell because when a mother gets home from working - all they want to do is relax.

The world that we live in is a two-parent - working society. AND THAT SUCKS. It's a requirement to pay all the bills on time.
But how fair is that? IT's actually not at all.

Now, all these working mothers are getting up, dropping of their kids at daycare, working 8, 9, even 10 hours, and picking their kids up. But the work doesn't stop there, they still have laundry, cleaning, cooking (sometimes) - shopping (it's a girls neccesity).

Do your dads clean the house weekly - do enough laundry for your teenage -extremely picky clothes wearing daughter - to make it a week of school in clothes?

A household isn't perfect - but the family -togetherness - is gone.

Everybody needs to help out for a family to survive - Take my household for an example.

To pay the bills -

my dad works mon-fri, 8 - 6 at his day job. Plus he also works 3 days a week + sat. at his nighttime job.

My mom works mon-sat 9-6 at her job.

I am the only child living at home. I also work (at a daycare with 90% of the time the mothers do the dropping off and picking up) to get the things that I need ....

To clean the house...

I do half of the cleaning... My mom does the rest (ok...ok... sometiems i only do 25% of it...)

And my dad does nothing unless my mom is having a hard time (she's got anxiety probs - but who doesn't in these days - but don't get me going on that...)

I do laundry almost 3 days a week... if my dad needs clean jeans... I THROW A LOAD IN.
My mom does laundry only on sats... and only every other.

Our house hold barely runs as it is. But theres no communication.

My mom and dad talk after i go to bed. But the only time i get to talk to my mom (on a woman-to-woman bassis) is before my dad gets home from work... its about a 30 minute time frame. My mom is always too tired, or got to much to do.

THIS WORLD SUCKS...........

Joey: Why exactly is it your place to define a family? What about single mothers who's husbands abandonded them leaving them flat? It is just as much a father's duty to raise a child as it is a mother's. What is strange to me is that you not only fit the perfect sexist-male sterotype but you also fit your own accustaion of "problem children." Hey, you're calling yourself dumb when you fail to come up with greater vocabulary to replace the bad language

This board just got a hell of alot better

The union of marriage means that both mothers and FATHERS both share the regrets and rewards of having children. Parenting goes both ways. My father was the stay at home parent, my mother is the worker. When he died, my mother continued working. It was my MOTHER who taught me how to drive. It was my MOTHER who helped me get a job. And it was my MOTHER who helped me get into college. Parenting is tough, but single parenting is even tougher, especially when its two teenage daughters. So stop dissing the profession of a stay at home mom.

Dr. Laura Schlesinger once said "Many SAHM's (Stay at Home Mom)'s I've worked with have talked about neighbors shunning them or ridiculing them behind their back."

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Joey...I am appalled that the background of your 'picture' shows the UN's sign since your comment is completely against what the organization stands for

Thus, the skull superimposed on the UN symbol.

....whaaaaat?! *sigh* nevermind. haha, i thought there were plenty of problems in this country before women went to work.

i wonder if the english held doors open for indians when they came into the americas.

joey where do u get this info. from?