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Picture of finn620
Registered: January 16, 2004
Posts: 3993
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I like to refer to them as "sub-babies".


L'enfer, c'est les autres. -Jean-Paul Sartre
Picture of Maya
Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1322
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quote:

This is only true temporarily; it is rather unsatisfactory to say that a fetus is not a life on the basis that it is merely contiguous with its mother for the time being.

I never said it's not a life. All I said is it's part of the woman's body, and she should have control over her body not anyone else. I realize it's a life and abortion ends it, sure.

And Nephilem, I don't care what the dictionary says, I don't equate a fetus to a born child, and that's not even the point anyway.


Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
Picture of Brehon
Registered: January 22, 2005
Posts: 716
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quote:
But what they fail to understand is that it's part of the woman's body and therefore completely dependant on her.

This is only true temporarily; it is rather unsatisfactory to say that a fetus is not a life on the basis that it is merely contiguous with its mother for the time being.


Only simple and quiet words will ripen of themselves. For a whirlwind does not last a whole morning, nor does a sudden shower last the entire day.
Picture of Nephilem
Registered: February 10, 2007
Posts: 691
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quote:
For me to be able to understand the pro-life argument I'd have to think the fetus is "an innocent baby", which I don't.

Well here’s a definition of fetus
quote:
The unborn child from the start of the ninth week after conception to the time of birth.

Notice the phrase unborn child.


"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Albert Einstein
Picture of Maya
Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1322
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quote:
This world is severly lacking in empaths, which I find quite sad.

I agree


Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
Picture of Shade
Registered: December 27, 2006
Posts: 3981
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Smile I know. I completely know. But I'm not talking about the issue at all. Or I wasn't in my most recent post. *shrugs* Whatever. This world is severly lacking in empaths, which I find quite sad.


...a Wandering Star for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever...
Picture of Maya
Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1322
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I'm sorry shade. I explained it best I could Roll Eyes. I understand that people who are pro-life equate the fetus with a baby, so naturally they think it's cruel and sick murder. But what they fail to understand is that it's part of the woman's body and therefore completely dependant on her.


Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
Picture of Shade
Registered: December 27, 2006
Posts: 3981
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It's simple unwillingness. I can't comprehend how people can't see the other side. That's not holding true to your beliefs, it's the inability to connect with our fellow person, the inability to empathise.


...a Wandering Star for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever...
Picture of Maya
Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1322
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For me to be able to understand the pro-life argument I'd have to think the fetus is "an innocent baby", which I don't. I'd also have to see a women's body not as her own but as mine(and all pro-life people), because I have control over what she does to her body. As you can see, I can't put myself in anothers shoes with this issue...


Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
Picture of Shade
Registered: December 27, 2006
Posts: 3981
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I can, but not with this issue. I agree with both sides.


...a Wandering Star for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever...
Picture of YouthVoice
Registered: January 16, 2003
Posts: 12687
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Ah, yes. Sadly, I don't think there are many people willing to try and put themselves in someone else shoes.


"In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act." - George Orwell
Picture of Shade
Registered: December 27, 2006
Posts: 3981
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quote:
Is it wrong to kill a baby right after it is born?

It's wrong to kill regardless. But that's not the point we're trying to bring up. This is why "pro-life" and "pro-choice" people can't argue the issue. They're debating different sides. If we could both just remove ourselves from the situation, and for a second, argue the other person's argument ( eg: pro choice people debating on the murder aspect, and pro life people debating on the choice, while ignoring their previous stance ) we might make some ground here.


...a Wandering Star for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever...
Picture of Nephilem
Registered: February 10, 2007
Posts: 691
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quote:
contributed by your extremely stupid post...I hadn't read one that dumb in a long longggggggggg time.

Shirley did make legitimate points, albeit over simplified.
Is it wrong to kill a baby right after it is born?


"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Albert Einstein
Picture of Maya
Registered: November 27, 2004
Posts: 1322
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LMAO I almost fell out of my chair LTR! and shirley you also contributed by your extremely stupid post...I hadn't read one that dumb in a long longggggggggg time.


Democracy is the recurrent suspicion that more than half of the people are right more than half of the time. - E.B.White
Picture of LoveTheRainbow
Registered: October 28, 2005
Posts: 5354
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Where was YN and their condoms when we needed it?


draft beer not soldiers...
Picture of ShirleySweet
Registered: February 19, 2007
Posts: 6
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It is stupid I cant believe they get away with murder just beacues the baby cant defend itself. The baby heart starts beating after couple weeks and the brains starts working after about a month so why does it make it ok? Abortion does equal murder and murder should equal JAIL!!!!!!!!! Mad
Picture of Nephilem
Registered: February 10, 2007
Posts: 691
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If innocent babies are being killed, I think that I can speak out on weather I think the practice is wrong or not, and I also think that I should be able to suggest ways to fix the problem.


"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Albert Einstein
Picture of LoveTheRainbow
Registered: October 28, 2005
Posts: 5354
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quote:
So to bring it back to abortion, you would agree that the actions of some abortion clinic bomber should not be used as the description of what the entire pro life movement is like.

Of course, but I also think that it's none of your god damn business if someone has an abortion or not. Please get of your high horse.

Edit: Please try to keep things civil LTR.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: NightSkyMod,


draft beer not soldiers...
Picture of Nephilem
Registered: February 10, 2007
Posts: 691
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quote:
I'm sorry. I forgot to make my sarcasm clear.

So to bring it back to abortion, you would agree that the actions of some abortion clinic bomber should not be used as the description of what the entire pro life movement is like.


"Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind." Albert Einstein
Picture of LoveTheRainbow
Registered: October 28, 2005
Posts: 5354
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quote:
This also has a flipside and affects you to. If you say it is unfair to Jude Muslims by the actions of Muslim extremists, then it is also unfair to Judge Christians by the actions of radical, insane Christians.

I'm sorry. I forgot to make my sarcasm clear.


draft beer not soldiers...
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