Subconciously, oppinionted, you are here because you do believe something about it. This is why we are all at YN. We want to debate, but in order to do so properly, one has to be able to take both sides. If not, one wouldn't be as willing to debate your side. (And that doesn't mean openly, that includes just with yourself.) If we all agreed completely on black and white issues, there would be no need for this website. However, there are much more often gray issues in life. You've just happened to take a less common pole of the spectrum.

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Sure…or shoplifters? I think it's reasonable to place irresponsible sexual people in this class.

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Please, sexuality is something a lot more personal than shoplifting.

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Let me pose a question: Since you think there are only three reasons (very rare ones at that) abortion should be allowed, would you rather have abortion totally banned (saving over a million babies a year that would have been killed by a means of birth control, but forcing the small amount of women who are pregnant by the rare cases to birth the baby) or have the abortion law stand as it is (with about 1.5 Million babies being killed by abortion – the vast majority by a means of birth control - but having the victims of rape, incest, and danger to health being able to get an abortion)?

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I think the best way to fall on an agreement is to limit the number of abortions anyone can have. I mean, it's pretty rare to get raped twice, and in that way abortion can't be used as birth control either.

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O right, because thinking = doing math. So, in that case, pretty much every kid under the age of 5 is "just a blob of cells."

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Ever heard of comparisons? When I say think, I mean... have an opinion, be heard, etc (and trust me, my sister has had the two since her birth).

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Animals think. They have the ability to realize that they are walking and that it is daytime, etc. That is thinking. Anyway, with your theory, people who are knocked unconscious are non-human, right

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That's an instinct behaviour (****, I'm spelling British). I think people who have been unconsious after a number of years should be just left to die, in honesty. All they put is the family in a worry frenzy as they need machines to live. That's not living, that's being an empty shell.

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I am not taking away birth control. If people don't have self-control, then I can't take it away. I am just saying that if you happen to get pregnant (birth control does not always work) by choosing to have sex, and you are unable to take care of the child, then you should get some punishment.

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Under your government, the idea for punishment for sex is a violation of rights. Sex is human, whether the Bible or the government wants to acknowlegde it or not. Some people will wear a chastitiy belt till they get married, others won't. Punishment for sexuality is simply offensive and degrading.

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Yeah, because the last time I checked both parents are female.

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Well, I don't understand what you're saying. But, if I'm right, then this is what I've to say. The man's contribution to the pregnancy was 2 minutes of humping (which he enjoyed and sometimes the woman doesn't if she's nervous or something) and one sperm cell. The woman has the damn eggs nearly all her life, and then has to carry it around for months. The man should not have a single say in it.

Sure you won't be shocked now that your expecting it. Bogey spoiled the surprise lol

Just making sure. Still don't think there will need for me to be shocked, though.

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I mean EVERYONE, Bogey, not just a group of people or the majority or what not.

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I know what you meant.

I mean EVERYONE, Bogey, not just a group of people or the majority or what not.

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I shall be shocked if people ever agree completely on this topic.

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Shocked you shall be, Ikki!

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if you are trying to get everyone here to say that abortion should be legal you are wasting your time

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I could say the same except with illegal. Let's face it. I shall be shocked if people ever agree completely on this topic.

hydrok, if you are trying to get everyone here to say that abortion should be legal you are wasting your time because i will NEVER say that abortion is ok for ANY reason. it should be illegal, and nobody can convince me otherwise. you have twisted both ohio's and bogey's words to get what you wanted ; that is why i am making myself very clear about where i stand on this topic now before you have a chance to twist my words

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At least, from what I've heard, babies don't do math on the womb.

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O right, because thinking = doing math. So, in that case, pretty much every kid under the age of 5 is "just a blob of cells."

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No, I consider something a human when it thinks, that's what separates us from the rest of the animal kingdom

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Animals think. They have the ability to realize that they are walking and that it is daytime, etc. That is thinking. Anyway, with your theory, people who are knocked unconscious are non-human, right?

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That's what birth control is for. If you want abortion banned, fine, but don't take away the birth control from the girls.

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I am not taking away birth control. If people don't have self-control, then I can't take it away. I am just saying that if you happen to get pregnant (birth control does not always work) by choosing to have sex, and you are unable to take care of the child, then you should get some punishment.

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So what prisoners do?

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Sure…or shoplifters? I think it's reasonable to place irresponsible sexual people in this class.

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That's the most female degrading crap I've heard in a while.

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Yeah, because the last time I checked both parents are female.

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Ok I get it now... so far we have gotten the most extreme person so far to admit that abortion is sometimes necissary

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That's been my revealed stance the whole time on this thread.

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Me and the rest of the sane world- not ok but in cases such as rape, incest, and when the mother is in danger...

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Let me pose a question: Since you think there are only three reasons (very rare ones at that) abortion should be allowed, would you rather have abortion totally banned (saving over a million babies a year that would have been killed by a means of birth control, but forcing the small amount of women who are pregnant by the rare cases to birth the baby) or have the abortion law stand as it is (with about 1.5 Million babies being killed by abortion – the vast majority by a means of birth control - but having the victims of rape, incest, and danger to health being able to get an abortion)?

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Ohio-ok when mothers life is in danger

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Let me clarify my opinion a bit more for you. I feel that abortion no matter when it is done in the pregnancy is the stopping of a human life. Stopping of a human life is the death of that human. Anything that is not a natural death (caused by natural reasons, not forced or helped) then that is killing it. Killing it would be murder. If the mother's life is in danger and that is as well endangering the childs then maybe abortion could be an option. Killing a baby for selfish reasons for your own irresponsible behavior is wrong In my opinion. Abortion should not be an option for those people. If the mother had any dignity or love in her heart for the child that she is caring she would give up her life that she has had the chance to live already to her unborn child who has not yet lived a life (outside of the womb) I'm not saying that women should do this nessecarily but that any woman that loved their baby more then their life would. Is this any clearer?

...or shorten

Hey, at least I don't abbreviate.

1)i have read articles but i don't remember where they can be found on the internet by i will see if i can find them.


2)my aunt has recently had a c-section and she asked the doctor about any complications that could occur.

3)in my attempts to prove my point i have called the local hospital question center and i asked, they said that if they are both assumed to be in danger that a c-section could be done in an attempt to save them. there are cases when something has happened during the procedure and one or sometimes both have died. but this is rare

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if the doctors believe that they are both in danger they could try a c-section to try to save the baby, and if done properly, it should not injure the mother.

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Do you have a source for this?

my screen name isn't opinionated, it is oppinionted, it is just an inside joke and i don't feel like explaining

anyway... hydrok, have you ever heard of a case where both the mother and the child were going to die, ok yes i have heard of cases in which they both did end up dieing but it was all caused by problems during the delivery. if you know of where i can find an article or something about a case like this please tell me (i am not saying that this type of case never happens i would just like to read about it) if the doctors believe that they are both in danger they could try a c-section to try to save the baby, and if done properly, it should not injure the mother.

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Me and the rest of the sane world- not ok but in cases such as rape, incest, and when the mother is in danger...

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It depends what you consider as the mother being indanger.
I also think it is unfair to call anyone who doesn't agree with your idea part of the insane world.

Ok i get it now... so far we have gotten the most extreme person so far to admit that abortion is sometimes necissary

so thats 2 down one to go, I believe that oppinionted is the only one that hasn't caved yet.

In review
Ohio-ok when mothers life is in danger
Bogey-When both will die during pregnancy
Me and the rest of the sane world- not ok but in cases such as rape, incest, and when the mother is in danger...

(For the record i was just trying to open up a new vein when I talked about the mental/physical defects, the debate was getting tired, i dont really believe in that)

My point, oppinionated, (and now a while back) was that you were putting words in people's mouths. You don't even know what other people may think on the issue, yet you feel obligated to explain as if you ARE that person! It upset me, to say the least.

You might as well have said, "You know my life pretty well."
Then I say "No, explain."
But you reply, "You know what I mean."

UTTER CONFUSION, UTTER CONFUSION.

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So we should be able to take the lives of people who are autistic or have other mental disorders if we so choose, because there are some humans who are incapable of thought.

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They think. Mental disorders and autism don't prevent people from thinking.