I think abortion is fine. I'm not saying go and get 5 abortions, but it's a womens right. And if they make it illegal, they're taking away a womens right, which is wrong. Just my opinion.
-Sunset

truthfully i hope i am never put in that position,ikki14reed, but i don't think i could live with myself if i ever had an abortion just to save myself.

yogore, i am not going to waste my time arguing with you about whether or not you made sense because it is obvious that i could never convince you to agree with me, and i'm glad that you thought you made your point but you should concider who else understood you.

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i caught your point it was just sencless

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It made sense.

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true, it doesn't have to be related, but in no way did you help yourself by using this analogy.

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That's your opinion. I made the point that I wanted to.

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if a woman has any morals at all she would rather her child live and herself die.

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Let me ask you this. If you were pregnant, and knew that the baby would kill you sooner than later, what would you do? Can you honestly say you would do that?

In answer to that question, I cannot answer that until I am put in a position such as that. You may think you would do something, but faced with that dilemma, you may not be so confident.

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Abortion=death=forever.

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I believe in reincarnation.

1) i caught your point it was just sencless 2)true, it doesn't have to be related, but in no way did you help yourself by using this analogy. 3)yes it can drive a mother insane but the woman usually had mental problems before and besides how often does that actually happen

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yes it is murder even with premeditated malice, but it is still murder without it

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you missed my point.

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i understand it is an analogy but it just doesn't make since why you would use that , it has nothing to do with this

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analogies don't have to be related.

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i never said that the mental state of a mother is not affected by the pregnancy but it does not drive the mother completely insane.

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It can.

yogore,1)yes it is murder even with premeditated malice, but it is still murder without it.2) i understand it is an analogy but it just doesn't make since why you would use that , it has nothing to do with this.3)i never said that the mental state of a mother is not affected by the pregnancy but it does not drive the mother completely insane.

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your theory of abortion not being murder was bad enough but your theory of mothers going insane after having a child is even worse

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The second one was not me.

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why are you camparing humans to birds? once again these are children not animals.

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It's an analogy, duh.

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the definition of murder is the killing of a human by another human

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especially with premeditated malice.

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what is all this talk of mental states

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pregnancy effects mental states. It is relevant.

well a 12 yr old rape victim is a understandable compared to a grown woman who willingly had sex. If you ask me she put herself in that situation. I know it sounds mean but that is how I feel on the issue.

i am not ashamed of being a christian nobody should be ashamed of their religion, no matter what it is.

the definition of murder is the killing of a human by another human. what is all this talk of mental states, having a child does not drive you insane. why are you camparing humans to birds? once again these are children not animals.your theory of abortion not being murder was bad enough but your theory of mothers going insane after having a child is even worse

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Not always. Insanity can be often cured. Depending the seriousness of the condition.

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I had nearly 4 years of my life in a form of insanity. It wasn't my whole life, but I didin't enjoy that time.

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insanity=living death= forever.

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Not always. Insanity can be often cured. Depending the seriousness of the condition.

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The mother may feel differently about it after seeing and holding the child.

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In my case, I fantasized about its death when I thought about it possibly being born. I know, I'm evil when in a bad state of mind.

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You don't need a source for common knowledge. Abortion=death=forever.

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insanity=living death= forever.

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Source, please.

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You don't need a source for common knowledge. Abortion=death=forever.

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How would being forced to carry a child make you love it all of a sudden? All of these things can be achieved in other ways that have fewer consequences.

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The mother may feel differently about it after seeing and holding the child.

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It is how you interpret the especially with predetermined malice. I take that to mean "with malice, especialy premeditated malice" and you take it a different way. It doesn't say "the unlawful killing of one human by another not necessarily with malice, especially with premeditated malice" either.

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So your saying that when someone accidently kills somebody in, lets say a car accident and has to face prison time for murder. Does that mean that the person did it out of malice so thats why its classified as murder?

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I'm sure there are many individual cases. But, to name a few: a change in heart, a lesson of responsibility, a sense of love, etc. I'm sure the list can go on and on

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A change in heart? Like I went around murdering people before my abortion. A lesson in resposibilty? What, you think people who get abortion are low-life whóres? A sense of love? All that thing called child brought me was a sense of hatred I've never felt before.

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The damages would (if at all) mild compared to that of abortion.

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Source, please.

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I don't see how this proves anything.

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It proves that we don't know all of the consequences.

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I'm sure there are many individual cases. But, to name a few: a change in heart, a lesson of responsibility, a sense of love, etc. I'm sure the list can go on and on

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How would being forced to carry a child make you love it all of a sudden? All of these things can be achieved in other ways that have fewer consequences.

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It doesn't say, "The unlawful killing of one human by another with malice, especially premeditated malice." The only mentioning of "malice" is at the end with the encouraged point.

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It is how you interpret the especially with predetermined malice. I take that to mean "with malice, especialy premeditated malice" and you take it a different way. It doesn't say "the unlawful killing of one human by another not necessarily with malice, especially with premeditated malice" either.

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O, I see. Since this happens to pretty much every woman who wants an abortion, abortion should be open to every pregnant woman. *sense the sarcasm*

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Use the mind granted. I was talking about an unwanted pregnancy. In most cases of women who had an abortion I know and in my personal expirience with it, there would have been more damage if the abortion was not done.

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I meant the egg to include the bird that is inside.

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Well, if there is a bird inside of the egg, then of course there is a bird.

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No, which is my point exactly.

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I don't see how this proves anything.

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And I wonder, what are these positive effects?

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I'm sure there are many individual cases. But, to name a few: a change in heart, a lesson of responsibility, a sense of love, etc. I'm sure the list can go on and on.

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The definition is open to some interpretation. I took it to mean especially premeditated malice as opposed to just malice in general.

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It isn't open to some discussion, really. The definition states:

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The unlawful killing of one human by another, especially with premeditated malice.

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It doesn't say, "The unlawful killing of one human by another with malice, especially premeditated malice." The only mentioning of "malice" is at the end with the encouraged point.

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A deteriorated mental state can take your life away, even if you remain breathing. A life in mental hospitals and when you can't live without pills for the mind is insane enough. Add a possible case of a family who abandons you for it and you're ruined.

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O, I see. Since this happens to pretty much every woman who wants an abortion, abortion should be open to every pregnant woman. *sense the sarcasm*

A suicide caused by a deteriorated mental state is permanent, and likely worse than abortion if the mother was pregnant with the child at the time of the suicide. Or, the murder or abandoning of the child after it's born.

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] No, i am not an expert,m just informed. The mother's life doesnt have to be endangered for the pregnancy to cause wear to her body.

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The wear on her body then shouldn't be an issue or a reason for abortion then if her life isn't in any danger. The damages would (if at all) mild compared to that of abortion. Which I mean that the abortion is taking the life of a human and that will last forever. Non-life-threatening damages done to the mother are only temporary.